#Soylent | Logs for 2014-09-25
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[00:00:15] <geotti> some rely on bash, but yeah that would qualify as a "workaround" ; )
[00:01:53] <chromas> Or fix cgi so it doesn't use system variables. Good place for virtualization or chroot maybe
[00:01:58] <geotti> so, in short, any service that sets environment variables may be affected
[00:02:15] <geotti> chromas: it does per specification
[00:02:45] <geotti> cgi maps the http header to environment variables
[00:02:53] <geotti> so, game over right away : )
[00:02:55] <juggs> hmm, not getting offered the updated 4.1-3+deb6u1 on a squeeze box
[00:03:13] <geotti> on squeeze, add -lts to sources.lst
[00:03:14] <systemd> I think I'll just to ahead and take over system variables
[00:03:19] <geotti> hold on
[00:03:39] <geotti> juggs: https://wiki.debian.org here
[00:03:40] <monopoly> ^ 04Wiki: 0303LTS/Using - Debian Wiki: LTS/Using - Debian Wiki Wiki
[00:05:00] <juggs> thanks geotti - time to have a quick smoke, grab a beer and get on that me thinks
[00:05:03] <geotti> homebrew++ for fixing my os x
[00:05:03] <Bender> karma - homebrew: 1
[00:05:25] <geotti> juggs: fellow soylentils are always welcome
[00:10:33] <juggs> damn I need to pay more attention. Should I have added these repos back in May?? :/
[00:15:36] <geotti> I forgot to do that as well
[00:15:45] <geotti> but that served a good reminder today : )
[00:16:20] <geotti> on redhat apparently the dhcp client is vulnerable : ) Must be a fun day tomorrow in colleges
[00:16:50] <juggs> Yay - 39 updates pulled in having added the lts repos and now....
[00:16:52] <juggs> Installed: 4.1-3+deb6u1
[00:16:52] <juggs> Candidate: 4.1-3+deb6u1
[00:16:57] <juggs> happy days
[00:17:08] <geotti> yeah, they backported the patch
[00:17:30] <geotti> https://security-tracker.debian.org
[00:17:30] <monopoly> ^ 03CVE-2014-6271
[00:31:02] <juggs> good stuff - just the laptop left to do - which will take a while over my crappy 3g connection :D
[00:34:44] <paulej72> OK I had to add viagra and cialis filters to the lameass filters on the site. I also took the time to fix te wording on the rest of the fileters to help when a subject is missing
[00:35:23] <chromas> Those links could've helped us grow
[00:35:39] <geotti> organically
[00:35:41] <geotti> ; )
[00:35:51] <chromas> Make sure SN gets bigger and lasts longer
[00:36:34] <geotti> someone submit this as news item maybe? here's a copy paste from a forum post I did, feel free to adapt for SN and submit as article
[00:36:37] <geotti> i gotta go to bed
[00:36:39] <geotti> http://pastebin.com
[00:36:39] <monopoly> ^ 03Upgrade yer boxen, gents, lest they get pwned. According to [url=https://marc - Pastebin.com
[00:40:33] <geotti> night
[00:40:41] <geotti> stay safe : )
[00:40:51] -!- geotti has quit [Quit: zzZZzzz]
[00:42:41] <n1> story is coming up any minute
[00:48:56] * SpallsHurgenson 's finger hovers over the button that will reset the world back to 1978 so we can try again
[00:49:04] -!- Subsentient [Subsentient!~WhiteRat@Soylent/Staff/Editor/Subsentient] has joined #Soylent
[00:49:04] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Subsentient] by juggler
[00:50:54] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Bash Widespread Vulnerability Discovered - http://sylnt.us - well,-that's-not-ideal
[00:53:38] <juggs> quick work n1!
[00:57:28] <Subsentient> $wz
[00:57:28] <aqu4> [Game 1] Name: Fear the gerbils | Map: MiniRush-v2-T1 | Host: Subsentient | Players: 2/4 | IP: 216.161.165.96 | Version: 3.1.1
[00:57:29] <aqu4> End of games list.
[01:17:41] <n1> the other breaking news, according to Forbes is that bendgate may 'break' the apple watch.
[01:17:44] <n1> ¬_¬
[01:21:21] <chromas> "It's not stupid; it's /advanced/!"
[01:25:03] <silverly> bendgate?
[01:25:50] <chromas> If it's scandalous, you can bet there's a gate nearby
[01:27:27] <n1> "Designed For Trouble? The Apple Logo Itself Could Be Contributing To Bendgate"
[01:27:45] <n1> Forbes again...
[01:28:05] <chromas> They're just helping out the scientific community. folding@home
[01:29:30] <n1> chromas on a roll.
[01:34:42] <Leebert> Ahhh, what a great night to be trying to get unix admins to answer their phones.
[01:38:56] <SirFinkus> yeah, that bash exploit is a doozy
[01:39:19] <paulej72> crap the spam in one of are other articles was not the same cialis an viagra spam as the other story. It did not look like I could filter it effectivly
[01:42:29] <silverly> tea++
[01:42:29] <Bender> karma - tea: 56
[01:42:59] <n1> tea++
[01:42:59] <Bender> karma - tea: 57
[01:43:05] <n1> paulej72++
[01:43:05] <Bender> karma - paulej72: 72
[01:43:11] <paulej72> coffee++
[01:43:11] <Bender> karma - coffee: 849
[01:45:56] <Tachyon> the bash article is super important
[01:46:36] <SirFinkus> the scary part is all the routers and shit running it
[01:48:49] <chromas> amber_alerts_makin_muh_phone_yell_at_me--
[01:48:49] <Bender> karma - amber_alerts_makin_muh_phone_yell_at_me: -1
[01:49:03] <n1> Are we saying the patch is not a sufficient fix?
[01:49:06] <SpallsHurgenson> better than silver alerts
[01:49:21] * chromas goes off to make caramel for some apples
[01:49:48] <chromas> https://twitter.com
[01:49:52] <chromas> ^ is that any value?
[01:49:59] <Tachyon> fffffuuu
[01:50:02] <Tachyon> my openwrt
[01:52:01] <n1> thanks chromas
[01:52:54] -!- rand has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
[01:53:01] -!- FunPika [FunPika!~FunPika@Soylent/Staff/Wiki/FunPika] has joined #Soylent
[01:53:01] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v FunPika] by juggler
[01:57:53] <crutchy> running_out_of_curry_powder--
[01:57:53] <Bender> karma - running_out_of_curry_powder: -1
[01:59:01] <chromas> make more
[01:59:07] <chromas> http://io9.com
[01:59:12] <crutchy> hi FunPika. chromas is an anti-spam bot
[01:59:13] <ciri> hi i'm happy today! :D crutchy
[02:00:16] <crutchy> ciri is a real boy
[02:01:01] <chromas> when ciri tells a lie, arti has firewood and a bedroom toy
[02:01:31] <SirFinkus> motherfuckers, watching starship troopers on tv and some bullshit child abduction emergency
[02:01:34] <SirFinkus> who gives a shit
[02:01:56] <SpallsHurgenson> okay, that video just killed 3% of my brain.
[02:02:06] <chromas> they should pipe it to the family, who'se the most likely to know where the child is
[02:03:18] <SpallsHurgenson> and now I remember why I stopped watching TV
[02:03:45] <Landon> SpallsHurgenson: did some bullshit advertisements interrupt starship troopers?
[02:03:55] <chromas> Landon: amber alert
[02:04:00] <SirFinkus> I normally don't either, but I'm housesitting and dad has all the movie channels
[02:04:03] <Landon> chromas: in response to his recent line
[02:04:25] <Landon> I bought an OTA dvr for my wife last year, super handy
[02:04:34] <Landon> have to buffer like 10 minutes to watch a 30 minute show without commercials though
[02:04:34] <Landon> :\
[02:04:56] <SpallsHurgenson> and worse, when you are done buffering you still have to watch the show
[02:04:58] <SirFinkus> private trackers are neat
[02:05:03] * SpallsHurgenson goes to read a book instead
[02:05:46] <chromas> reading-- # since I just misread Landon's message
[02:05:46] <Bender> karma - reading: -2
[02:06:00] <crutchy> omg. that video makes CSI seem realistic. even the scene with two of them bashing away at the same keyboard
[02:07:09] <chromas> crutchy: s/CSI/NCIS/
[02:07:09] <SedBot9000> <chromas> <crutchy> omg. that video makes NCIS seem realistic. even the scene with two of them bashing away at the same keyboard
[02:07:15] <Landon> hah, scorpion!
[02:07:19] <Landon> that was rough to watch
[02:07:24] <Landon> had it on in the background
[02:07:26] <SirFinkus> all those crime shows just piss me off
[02:07:34] <Landon> I mean, seriously
[02:07:44] <Landon> dangle cat5 from 7*7 and connect it to a laptop
[02:07:49] <Landon> and expect it to just pull the laptop up with it?
[02:07:53] <chromas> nstf:sd:suv::
[02:07:54] <Landon> have you ever _used_ a cat5!
[02:07:54] <SirFinkus> a lot of them revolve around renegade cops who don't give a fuck about the constitution
[02:07:58] <SirFinkus> pur propoganda
[02:08:01] <SirFinkus> pure even
[02:08:05] <Landon> that thing is going to slip out with a breath of moist air
[02:08:41] <crutchy> ima hax0rz cos i can drive a car while my gf plugs a cord into a laptop, passed down by the usual sacrificial black guy
[02:09:07] * chromas knows from experience that headphone cables stay plugged in until the netbook's off the countertop
[02:09:09] <SpallsHurgenson> years and years ago, a laptop was dragged behind my car (fell out when I was closing the door) and dragged by the CAT5 cable for about a mile before I noticed
[02:09:12] <Landon> there was plenty of actual bad stuff though
[02:09:24] <Landon> "We've got to get to a location with stable internet. Let's go to the diner where I repaired their wifi"
[02:09:41] <SpallsHurgenson> don't ask why I didn't notice the damn thing bouncing around behind me. I'm not proud of that :)
[02:09:45] <crutchy> i thought airliners had wifi
[02:10:02] <SpallsHurgenson> point is, sometimes those cat5 cables are stuck in there good :)
[02:10:03] <Landon> gotta have your credit card number ready for that!
[02:10:12] <FunPika> IE8 on XP...nice to know wiki spammers are using outdated software.
[02:10:29] <Landon> SpallsHurgenson: my experience is that after 2-3 uses, the "catch" part is gone
[02:10:31] <crutchy> damn. if i want wifi i won't be able to afford a ferarri
[02:10:37] <Landon> unless you have a boot, then it's almost impossible to take out
[02:11:17] <SirFinkus> people_who_break_the_retention_tabs_off_cat5_cables--
[02:11:17] <Bender> karma - people_who_break_the_retention_tabs_off_cat5_cables: -1
[02:11:33] <Landon> pulling the cat5 out of the drawer? it's going to snag on itself
[02:11:36] <Landon> and there goes the tab! :)
[02:12:22] <paulej72> Landon: you do not need a cat5, too dangerous to have stuff on the net :)
[02:12:24] <SpallsHurgenson> fuck, I've had some cat5s plugged in so tightly I almost couldn't get 'em out
[02:12:25] <n1> people_who_break_the_retention_tabs_off_cat5_cables--
[02:12:25] <Bender> karma - people_who_break_the_retention_tabs_off_cat5_cables: -2
[02:12:33] * crutchy bought some rj45 connectors yesterday. shop assistant: 'you can get a pack of six or even fifty'. me: do you have any boots: "no we have them on back order"
[02:12:36] <swiss> my laptop is so bad
[02:12:51] <SpallsHurgenson> plug one of those suckers into the plane, the other end into a router in the ground and its better than an arrestor cable on an aircraft carrier :)
[02:12:52] <Landon> although the real cake-taker
[02:12:53] <swiss> crutchy: you mean 8p8c connectors
[02:12:57] <Landon> for behind-the-computer interfaces
[02:13:08] <swiss> i broke the center pin for power n my laptop
[02:13:08] <crutchy> big phone plugs :p
[02:13:10] <Landon> is the guy who put the CMOS RESET right next to the ethernet plug ins
[02:13:10] <SirFinkus> more cables need retention
[02:13:15] <swiss> so charger no longer charges
[02:13:15] <SirFinkus> usb would be nice
[02:13:21] <Landon> it's not a paperclip button, you can reset with your finger
[02:13:34] <swiss> crutchy: rj45 doesn't exist!
[02:13:43] <Landon> second biggest winner is the guy who decided USB width would fit inside an ethernet port roughly snugly
[02:13:59] <paulej72> swiss: the new USB C connector will allow bi directional charging
[02:13:59] <crutchy> omg i imagined it!?
[02:14:05] <swiss> paulej72: cool
[02:14:08] <swiss> crutchy: yep
[02:14:18] <swiss> just like a DB9 connector is imaginary
[02:14:23] <crutchy> damn
[02:14:31] <swiss> DB9, completely mythical
[02:14:48] <crutchy> all my rs232 stuff was a figment of my imagimination :(
[02:14:52] <swiss> unless you are an idiot and used b sided casing and put only 9 pins in
[02:15:00] <swiss> DB25 is real though
[02:15:06] -!- KonomiNetbook has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[02:15:07] <SpallsHurgenson> can we mythicalize SCSI? Maybe then the nightmares will finally go away
[02:15:07] <swiss> DE9 also exists
[02:15:09] <paulej72> upto 100 W, and it has no orientation, can go in both ways
[02:15:20] <swiss> i won $50 from my dad by telling him that DB9 was fake
[02:15:35] <swiss> he was like "MY teachers at caltech were smart, they wouldn't have fucked up, hurrr"
[02:15:39] <swiss> and then i won $50
[02:15:51] <swiss> paulej72: as it should have been originally
[02:15:56] <crutchy> real hax0rz jam usb plugs into the IEC port of their ps, for extra powahz!
[02:15:58] <swiss> power is power is power
[02:16:01] <paulej72> yes it should have.
[02:16:22] <swiss> that's the same reason i'm gonna solder a dell power connector into my laptop
[02:16:43] <Landon> I just want magsafe for all laptops :(
[02:16:54] <Landon> is that too much to ask, apple?
[02:17:11] <SirFinkus> SERVICE GUARANTEES CITIZENSHIP
[02:17:16] <SirFinkus> good movie
[02:17:17] <paulej72> lol
[02:17:22] <Landon> the new connectors are really slick, running parallel to the sides
[02:17:30] <swiss> magsafe wouldn't be bad
[02:17:31] <crutchy> apple has security by ubiquity... everyone has them, so nobody needs/wants them
[02:17:37] <swiss> what's the voltage spec for those?
[02:17:38] <paulej72> SirFinkus: the book is much better
[02:17:45] <juggs> cat5_boots_that_within_a_year_degenerate_into_some_unobtainiumly_inflexible_protection_device_rendering_the_retention_clip_inaccessible--
[02:17:45] <Bender> karma - cat5_boots_that_within_a_year_degenerate_into_some_unobtainiumly_inflexible_protection_device_rendering_the_retention_clip_inaccessible: -1
[02:18:00] <juggs> that has to be the longest karma - go me xD
[02:18:07] <Landon> juggs: how about boots that slip imperceptibly until they no longer touch the clip
[02:18:09] <crutchy> juggs, need to upgrade to puss in boots
[02:18:13] <swiss> i am switching to dell plug cause i hav like 30 dell power adapters
[02:18:27] <Landon> swiss: barrel type?
[02:18:28] <crutchy> cat_in_boots--
[02:18:28] <Bender> karma - cat_in_boots: -1
[02:18:30] <swiss> juggs: my friend uses a boxcutter to chop those off
[02:18:34] <SirFinkus> "free with subscription"
[02:18:39] <swiss> Landon: yeah, but dell's specific barrel type
[02:18:40] <SirFinkus> well, that's one way of putting it
[02:18:40] <paulej72> Landon: if was not for that slipping, I would not be able to get most of them off the computer
[02:18:50] <Landon> paulej72: hah
[02:19:18] <paulej72> with the boot in place the tab is inaccessable
[02:19:19] <swiss> i have like... 4 HP barrel connectors by comparison
[02:19:19] <Landon> at one internship I was told that unspeakable things would happen to me if I put boots on :(
[02:19:38] <swiss> paulej72: ITS PROTECTING IT
[02:20:17] <juggs> swiss, it's just annoying - use a boot, then the boot goes hard, requiring pliers or some other application of unnecessary force - OR - don;t use one and the cable ends up yanked to shit and fails :(
[02:20:45] <crutchy> just tie the cable in a knot around the desk leg :p
[02:20:49] <swiss> i have come across nice boots on monoprice
[02:21:54] <paulej72> boot are only useful for pulling cables through shit and only are needed in a few cases. If you terminate your own cable you cna do all the pulling first then terminate and not have to worry about breakin the tab off
[02:22:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Samsung to Pull Out of Europe Laptop Market - http://sylnt.us - less-competition-is-bad
[02:22:26] <chromas> from the -sometimes-pulling-out-just-isn't-enough dept
[02:22:38] <swiss> what about the plastic ones that are more like humps
[02:22:38] <Landon> they need a boot
[02:22:39] <juggs> we should all go back to bnc type connections :D coax and terminators!
[02:22:44] <swiss> and aren't open on either end?
[02:22:50] <crutchy> ribbon_cable++
[02:22:50] <Bender> karma - ribbon_cable: 1
[02:22:53] <Landon> swiss: o.o sounds expensive
[02:22:58] <swiss> nah
[02:23:15] <Landon> crutchy: I have nightmares about soldering on connectors on each individual strand of ribbon cable
[02:23:44] <chromas> did they do that?
[02:23:52] <chromas> All the ones I have were pressed on
[02:23:54] <crutchy> if you make a 100m patch lead from coax it would be cheap per metre... think of the bulk savings!
[02:24:12] <swiss> Landon: http://www.broadbandbuyer.com
[02:24:16] <swiss> like that, but plastic all the way
[02:24:23] <paulej72> 8 conductor coax
[02:24:28] <Landon> chromas: for the individual strands, yeah, let me find a picture
[02:24:42] <Landon> but at the end where they're all connected you just clamp that whole contraption and it wasn't too bad
[02:25:05] <crutchy> need all mil spec barrel connectors on PCs. its the only way to be sure
[02:25:22] <swiss> lol
[02:25:24] <chromas> opitcal_fiber++
[02:25:24] <Bender> karma - opitcal_fiber: 1
[02:25:37] <SpallsHurgenson> cans_of_compressed_air++
[02:25:37] <Bender> karma - cans_of_compressed_air: 1
[02:25:45] <Landon> crutchy: Cable
[02:25:49] <Landon> whoops
[02:25:52] <Landon> http://www.instructables.com
[02:25:54] <Landon> there we go
[02:26:22] <crutchy> yeah nah :p
[02:26:31] <crutchy> i buy ribbon cables premade
[02:26:37] <crutchy> with the headers
[02:26:47] <chromas> Whoever came up with the idea to make all the cables to the front jacks (usb, audio) have individual pins should be shot in the face
[02:27:00] <paulej72> I was suing my cans of compressed air today. and I mean cans, as once they are uesed a few minutes they are too cold to produce any air. And I was too lazy to heat them up under hot water.
[02:27:17] <crutchy> just use rexona sport
[02:27:20] <chromas> paulej72: did you win?
[02:27:29] <crutchy> lasts 24 hours
[02:27:32] <paulej72> yes :)
[02:28:02] * chromas hopes almond milk works the same as animal milk in caramel
[02:28:29] <paulej72> chromas: Dell has a custom cable for there front pannel connections to the motherboard
[02:28:33] <crutchy> Landon, i've got this board: http://www.futurlec.com.au
[02:28:35] <monopoly> ^ 03ET-AVR Stamp Board
[02:28:57] <crutchy> with this micro: http://www.futurlec.com.au
[02:28:58] <monopoly> ^ 03ET-AVR Stamp Module
[02:29:18] <crutchy> handy having all headers premade :)
[02:29:40] <Landon> yeah :P
[02:29:54] <Landon> good soldering experience though for the ZIF/headers on the actual board
[02:30:01] <Landon> just the ribbon cable ended up an utter PITA
[02:30:14] <Landon> a little too small to clamp in the third hand
[02:30:43] * crutchy sucks at soldering. respect for anyone that can solder sm
[02:32:28] <crutchy> wholly carp. for AU$42 i might get this: http://www.futurlec.com.au
[02:32:29] <monopoly> ^ 03STM32F103 Development Board
[02:32:47] <paulej72> soldering is easier if you have lead based solder. Tin or Silver is a bitch
[02:33:27] <swiss> it's easy till you get stupid from inhaling the lead
[02:33:27] <crutchy> stm32 ony has 12 bit A/D, but still better than atmega128
[02:33:40] <swiss> i did work on a stm32f0 iirc
[02:33:49] <swiss> i have a couple discovery boards somewhere
[02:33:51] <swiss> fun stuff
[02:34:19] <crutchy> prolly better to use dedicated dsp chips for 16 bit a/d anyways
[02:34:27] <paulej72> what are we taking about, where am I again?
[02:34:37] <swiss> i was using the stm32f0 for hdmi switching
[02:34:46] <crutchy> dunno. i'm thinking about icecream
[02:34:46] <juggs> I have some solder here that came with an iron - no idea what it is but it has the magic ability to roll right off anything it is applied too.
[02:34:53] <swiss> controlled a few chips, but also played nice with CEC
[02:35:13] <paulej72> juggs: you need flux
[02:35:24] <crutchy> juggs, yeah i so know what that is like lol. that's my soldering all over
[02:35:35] <crutchy> even if i smother in flux
[02:35:43] <crutchy> maybe i need a flux capacitor
[02:35:45] -!- FunPika has quit [Quit: Leaving]
[02:35:47] <juggs> paulej72, that's using flux lol
[02:36:33] <paulej72> I gave up using lead free solder for copper water pipes and just changed it all to pvc and cpvc.
[02:36:48] -!- KonomiNetbook [KonomiNetbook!~Konomi@Soylent/Users/189/Konomi] has joined #Soylent
[02:37:07] <paulej72> hello KonomiNetbook
[02:37:07] <ciri> hello paulej72
[02:37:14] <Konomi> hey
[02:37:56] * crutchy offers Konomi a frozen yoghurt
[02:38:05] <Konomi> too cold ;_;
[02:38:24] <paulej72> how about a hot yoghurt
[02:38:24] <ciri> doing good, and you?
[02:38:29] <juggs> copper pipes I have no problem with. Although, these days I have mostly moved to yorkshire fittings (solder ring in fitting). It's just that one reel of solder that came with one particular iron that has this ability to just roll off for me (probably cheap ass solder as it was just thrown in with the iron)
[02:38:51] <chromas> paulej72: sounds like something for tama
[02:39:15] * crutchy gives tama an iron pipe fitting
[02:39:22] <paulej72> juggs, it could be a tin solder. that shit does not stick to anything
[02:39:34] <chromas> crutchy: is it butt-jointed?
[02:39:54] <crutchy> with solder and flux capacitors
[02:43:14] <crutchy> hm might need something like this for welding tama's buttpipe: http://www.crc-evans.com
[02:45:55] <juggs> paulej72, moer than likely, it was a fairly recent purchase - probably some regulation against lead solder these days.
[02:46:55] <paulej72> lead will kill all of the childern. they will chew on the the electronics so we need to remove it all.
[02:47:07] <paulej72> tin_wiskers—
[02:47:21] <paulej72> tin_wisker--
[02:47:21] <Bender> karma - tin_wisker: -1
[02:47:38] <Landon> whisker*
[02:49:51] <juggs> I think the concern is more around end of life when all this stuff ends up in landfill or some poor sod get to set fire to the lot of it in some developing country to try to recover a few scrapings of something precious.
[02:50:03] <crutchy> pod_coffee++
[02:50:03] <Bender> karma - pod_coffee: 1
[02:52:03] <juggs> I like moka pots
[03:07:16] <SpallsHurgenson> I like polka dots
[03:09:23] <juggs> I like the gaggia classic too. Design hasn't changed for many years and it's all user serviceable with a little screwdriver wielding. I guess I like my things simple like me :D
[03:11:21] * juggs paints pink polka dots on Spalls
[03:12:10] <SpallsHurgenson> I just use a simple coffee press. I like squishing the grinds :)
[03:20:05] <crutchy> coffee++
[03:20:05] <Bender> karma - coffee: 850
[03:21:27] <chromas> samsung-- # for making fastboot hard to invoke on galaxy tab 2
[03:21:27] <Bender> karma - samsung: -1
[03:29:10] <juggs> I had to look up what a coffee press is. We UK-ites call that a сafetière. Have one of those too.
[03:30:08] <crutchy> ~define coffee press
[03:30:14] <exec> [wikipedia] 3Coffee_press: A French press, also known as a press pot, coffee press, coffee plunger, cafetière (UK) or сafetière à piston, is a simple coffee brewing device patented by Italian designer Attilio Calimani in 19...
[03:30:29] <crutchy> ah. plunger coffee
[03:30:45] <crutchy> nice too, but not as lazy as pods :p
[03:30:54] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Artificial Intelligence that Imitates Children’s Learning - http://sylnt.us - we'll-need-day-care-for-the-ai
[03:31:47] <juggs> the only thing that alarms me about pods or those coffee bag type machines is the cost of pods and bags - they strike me as the inkjet of the coffee world.
[03:32:44] <chromas> you can get reusable pods
[03:33:03] <chromas> at least until they start putting drm in them
[03:33:41] <juggs> and you can refill inkjet cartridges too. Kinda defeats the convenience element I'd imagine having to reload pods :D
[03:34:12] <chromas> injets--
[03:34:12] <Bender> karma - injets: -1
[03:34:14] <chromas> printers--
[03:34:14] <Bender> karma - printers: -1
[03:34:25] <chromas> Bender: come on, that should be under -9000
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[03:36:53] <silverly> printers--
[03:36:53] <Bender> karma - printers: -2
[03:36:54] <juggs> what's wrong with printers? even cheapy samsung lasers have 50K service life on rollers and pickups.
[03:37:14] <silverly> drivers tend to be a pain in the ass
[03:39:40] <juggs> not really. pcl / pjl / ppd is pretty much a done deal on linux at least. Thank feck the days of those windows only printers, scanners and modems went away where half the functionality was in the driver blob rather than in the device. Now ~that~ was pure shite I admit.
[03:40:03] <chromas> printers++ # for starting the free software movement
[03:40:03] <Bender> karma - printers: -1
[03:41:00] <silverly> there is a few times in my life which i actually need to print stuff.
[03:41:09] <silverly> everything is just a pdf for me nowadays
[03:41:24] <silverly> this is coming as a student ofcourse
[03:45:56] <juggs> for sure - the requirement to print stuff is much less these days. Pretty much all I print these days is letters relating to financial transactions. Somehow a posted letter ~still~ carries more weight in legal arbitration than pretty much anything else. I guess the legal eagles will catch up eventually.
[03:49:56] <juggs> One thing that does concern me about my current printer: Main Motor on time: 1082 sec, 93%(Life Remaining) - I hope that's not an artificially imposed dead switch as if my calcs are right that equates to a motor that can only run for ~4.3 hours. Doesn't seem right to me :/
[03:51:11] <chromas> it's a challenge; you just have to find powerups along the way
[03:51:33] <chromas> if you find any hearts or plusses, put them into the printer
[03:54:58] <juggs> yup - I regularly find still beating hearts lying about the place as I go about my day to day. I'll be sure to pick one up and feed it to the printer. Makes absolute sense.
[03:58:06] <chromas> Sometimes they take cherries too
[03:59:39] <juggs> Sounds like PacMan
[04:02:15] <crutchy> parallel_ports++
[04:02:15] <Bender> karma - parallel_ports: 1
[04:03:03] <crutchy> cos they paved the way for printers that sounded like a ranting woman
[04:05:41] <SpallsHurgenson> EPP_ECP_Parallel_Ports++
[04:05:41] <Bender> karma - epp_ecp_parallel_ports: 1
[04:06:01] <SpallsHurgenson> 'cause they offer up to a whoppin' 1MB/s transfer rate :)
[04:06:20] <juggs> ahh - those lovely centronics parallel printer connectors with springy retainer clips. I was always rather partial to rs232 25 pin stuff though - if the cable requires a screwdriver or thumbscrews to connect you can be sure it ain't going anywhere soon. In hindsight - probably over the top in consumer applications :D
[04:07:06] <SpallsHurgenson> useful if you are debugging a plane's software from a speeding car, though :)
[04:12:34] <juggs> and we've all been there right! in fact I had to do exactly that just this afternoon. Twice. And whilst juggling two auto 50 cal weapons whilst typing with my earlobe, dealing with fog and a looming lava flow that was the reason for the speeding in the first place. Just another day at the office really.
[04:23:30] <crutchy> they should have got the ferrari with the retractable wings option
[04:45:39] <juggs> Isn't that the one that you can buy have to keep at the Ferrari factory and they allow you to drive on certain tracks on certain days by prior arrangement? Brings a new meaning to "fiat" cars :D Or maybe that was a lamborghini thing, I forget,
[04:47:32] <juggs> Oh no - lambo is VW-Audio group brand now - must have been a Ferrari thing that keep it at the factory.
[04:47:48] <juggs> lol "audio"
[04:47:49] <ciri> now that is funny
[04:48:59] <juggs> loling at ones own typos id not funny ciri. Not that I expect you to parse that.
[04:49:27] * SpallsHurgenson sings Chitty Chitty Bang Bang /What we'll do / Near, far, in our motor car / Oh what a happy time we'll spend./ Bang Bang Chitty Chitty Bang Bang / Our fine four fendered friend.
[04:49:38] <juggs> and making a typo in a comment about typos is guaranteed!
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[05:02:02] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - A Plea for Security that is Easy to Use? - http://sylnt.us - self-promotional-feelgoodness
[05:15:50] <silverly> tea++
[05:15:50] <Bender> karma - tea: 58
[05:17:26] <crutchy> g'day silverly
[05:19:28] <juggs> do you antipodeans have this abstinence october media fest going on?
[05:21:59] <crutchy> chiiiiitttyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!! https://www.youtube.com
[05:22:00] <monopoly> ^ 03Ace Ventura 2 - Crazy Drive Scene (HD720p) - YouTube
[05:22:42] * juggs throws crutchy out the window
[05:22:48] <silverly> gday!
[05:23:25] <crutchy> juggs prefers the window to the anvil :p
[05:24:28] * juggs throws the anvil out the window after crutchy
[05:25:13] <silverly> * throws the window at the anvil
[05:25:14] <Leebert> I find it hysterical that e-mailing an RPM file to someone via Outlook on my work computer puts a RealPlayer icon on said file.
[05:25:50] <chromas> Real Player gives you the RPMs you need
[05:26:34] <crutchy> cos it just goes round and round... and round and round and round :D
[05:26:44] <juggs> does real player even exist any more? I'm too disinterested to even check. Surely it died.
[05:26:53] <chromas> Does meatspin use rpm?
[05:26:53] <Leebert> It was like this unholy mix of almost everything I hate. Outlook, RealPlayer, and Red Hat.
[05:27:23] <crutchy> red hat is ok. it puts a face to linux :p
[05:27:57] <silverly> does real player even exist?
[05:28:15] <Leebert> Yeah, and I have yet to understand why it's still a part of our enterprise core load.
[05:28:22] <crutchy> its fake, like cereal ports
[05:28:55] <silverly> wow
[05:29:00] <silverly> that is insane
[05:30:23] <crutchy> if this is a cereal port, i want one!
[05:30:25] <crutchy> http://www.fansshare.com
[05:31:25] <silverly> i remember when i was living in canada there used to be games discs in my cereal boxes
[05:31:31] <silverly> that was pretty awesome
[05:31:50] <chromas> chexquest++
[05:31:50] <Bender> karma - chexquest: 1
[05:31:54] <crutchy> i remember that too
[05:32:06] <crutchy> corn_flakes++
[05:32:06] <Bender> karma - corn_flakes: 1
[05:33:41] <crutchy> http://www.youtube.com
[05:33:41] <monopoly> ^ 03Reckless Kelly Trailer - YouTube
[05:36:32] <juggs> silverly, Real Player certainly did it exist - I remember crafting different format streams for it and having to put up different linkages for rp, winamp and windows media player even though they were all sourcing the same shoutcast stream underneath all the BS. Can we not just Ogg + html5 audio standardised now? Do it in the browser in on format. ~sigh~ Not that it matters, audio streaming licensing has become ridiculous so there's not much point
[05:36:32] <juggs> ~double sigh~
[05:37:07] <juggs> so many typos so much wow
[05:40:16] <silverly> nah man, we need our own proprietary streaming protocol since business reasons (or maybe the open source stuff is hard to use/ licencing)
[05:40:40] <crutchy> http://xkcd.com
[05:40:41] <monopoly> ^ 03xkcd: Standards
[05:41:01] <crutchy> oh crap i visited xkcd
[05:41:08] <silverly> </end scarasm>
[05:41:26] <silverly> whats wrong with xkcd?
[05:42:08] * crutchy tries to refrain from clicking random button over and over and over in an infinite loop of entrapment
[05:42:21] <juggs> I can't see that xkcd again without suiciding.
[05:42:23] <silverly> HAHA
[05:42:44] <juggs> yah xkcd get you like that
[05:42:53] <silverly> that literally happened with the standard markdown nonsense
[05:44:46] <silverly> http://commonmark.org
[05:45:25] <silverly> and of course there is drama around that http://blog.codinghorror.com
[05:47:29] <juggs> or perhaps a few vocal nerds got excited and started espousing their latest epiphany. This is problematic. Let's take a current ragefest - systemd - there is so much noise and discombobulation from frankly completely unqualified blogger types that it is hard to discern what the feck is going on at all.
[05:49:32] <juggs> it confounds me that people are making a living commenting on others commentary of something they in turn had absolutely no hand in. It's some bizzare ritual.
[05:54:29] <juggs> I think we lost crutchy to the xkcd buttons. They probably made the foolish mistake of hitting "First" - we'll see them in 6 months or so going - "da faq, I entered xkcd, hit one button and now I'm skin and bone - some time may have passed though"
[05:56:47] <juggs> Same goes for some of the comics xkcd links in the footer..... some of those are like The Ring... really, it's better not to look. But now you will anyway!
[06:03:12] <juggs> muahahahaha - and so another generation is drawn in.
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[06:06:01] <silverly> i think people have a lot of feels nowadays and we all been trained to "share" them
[06:06:24] <keplr_prime> feels?
[06:07:04] <Konomi> bullcrap/stuff they ate for breakfest/insert inane crap here?
[06:07:06] <juggs> feeds perhaps?
[06:07:49] <keplr_prime> Feelings or emotions, as far as I can tell.
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[06:08:20] <keplr_prime> Never understood the entymology(?) of the meme
[06:10:17] * juggs blesses Konomi with Less Cynical Spell Ultra
[06:10:24] <Konomi> ;p
[06:10:39] <Konomi> I was going for realism
[06:10:47] * juggs notes it did not work and hides behind a large rock
[06:16:24] <crutchy> coffee++
[06:16:24] <Bender> karma - coffee: 851
[06:16:59] <juggs> Konomi, would you like to see a snap of my intended breakfast? I say "intended" as it is my breakfast planned for tomorrow that I already blogged about 3 days ago, but just felt it necessary to post this revised envisioning now we are closer to the point of certainty. Of course I will be sure to live tube the experience when it happens, just thought you may want advance notice.
[06:17:17] * juggs finds a bunker to hide in. Konomi scares me.
[06:17:23] <crutchy> i like trains
[06:17:23] <exec> http://www.youtube.com
[06:18:11] <Konomi> it'd be funny if I hadn't encountred almost every permutation of the things people call "jokes" already ;p
[06:19:33] <juggs> I believe that's called "getting older".
[06:20:45] <Konomi> but I'm only in my 30s ;_;
[06:21:01] <keplr_prime> Whatever, grandpa
[06:21:14] <Konomi> okay htere grandma ;p
[06:21:16] <juggs> Yah, that's how it goes Konomi .
[06:22:08] * Konomi goes back to her code
[06:22:18] <keplr_prime> I'm 25, I only feel old when I see how little kids know about computers these days.
[06:22:43] * juggs hugs Konomi and goes to bed. ~even though some annoying git has decided now is the time to fire up some noisy ass vegetation shredder~
[06:22:45] <keplr_prime> Haven't reached the missing jokes phase
[06:22:53] * Konomi hugs backs ~
[06:23:16] <Konomi> wondering where to take my pm-utils replacement
[06:24:33] <juggs> keplr_prime, embrace your youth. Once the humour is exhausted so are you. Then you end up bitter and twisted. ~grrr~
[06:24:36] <juggs> :D
[06:24:41] <juggs> out
[06:24:50] <Konomi> then when you get to 80 we'll put you in an android body
[06:24:57] <Konomi> but we'll mess it up and you'll end up in a robopet
[06:25:33] <keplr_prime> My mind is the only thing I really care about preserving, the meat body is really just a hinderance
[06:26:10] <crutchy> konomi is only pertending to be a girl so that we don't throw carrots
[06:26:11] <keplr_prime> Any kind of electro-mechanical form would be preferable
[06:26:22] <Konomi> I can switcxh
[06:26:25] <Konomi> free carrots sound good
[06:26:58] <crutchy> ~g'day Konomi
[06:26:59] <exec> * crutchy insubordinately throws a used franger of beer at Konomi
[06:27:13] <Konomi> classy ~
[06:27:36] <crutchy> you'll have to compete with the guinea pigs for carrots ;P
[06:27:55] <Konomi> I'd get distracted petting them
[06:28:02] <Konomi> they're so damn cute how could anyone resist
[06:28:10] <crutchy> yeah they purdy cute
[06:28:30] <crutchy> they flare up my athsma pretty bad though which sux
[06:28:31] <keplr_prime> This morning there were rabbits in my front yard. This is not a normal thing to see.
[06:28:37] <Konomi> there was a pet store near my bus run once
[06:28:38] <crutchy> i cuddle them for a little while
[06:28:50] <Konomi> I used to go there and watch the kittens and various other small cute creatures
[06:28:51] <keplr_prime> Very cute, but I couldn't catch one.
[06:29:17] <crutchy> you sure they werent droprabbits?
[06:29:39] <keplr_prime> Approaching 100% certainty
[06:29:45] <Konomi> wonder if that crowd funded horror movie involving drop bears will go anywhere
[06:30:03] <Konomi> oh god tony abbott is on unfilter
[06:30:32] <Konomi> you know your country is going to shit when a usa podcast plays a clip from your country
[06:31:01] <crutchy> wholly carp i typed drop rabbit into google image search and got this http://i00.i.aliimg.com
[06:31:15] * crutchy wants a drop rabbit now :D
[06:31:18] <keplr_prime> How do you think we feel? We hear US podcasts EVERY day
[06:32:45] <Konomi> pretty sure podcasts are something you seek out they don't find you ;p
[06:32:50] <crutchy> tony abbott iss obama's butt buddy
[06:33:18] <Konomi> tony abbott is his own butt buddy
[06:33:46] <Konomi> if there was a booming voice fromt he sky telling him he was wrong he'd still do whatever he wanted ;p
[06:33:48] <keplr_prime> I used to think Australia was a good country to move to if things got too bad here, but I'm not so sure anymore.
[06:34:22] <crutchy> autralia is still good. we're nowhere near as fucked up as other countries
[06:34:26] <Konomi> australia is starting to feel like stasi land at the moment
[06:34:43] <crutchy> at least our debt isn't out of control
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[06:35:09] <keplr_prime> Meh, that issue is overblown given the other factors of our economy and the world's monetary system.
[06:35:16] <crutchy> well, public debt. private debt is batshit crazy out of control
[06:35:19] <Konomi> crutchy: that's obviously sarcasm but yeah it's gone up since those bungling idiots got in
[06:35:22] <Konomi> >.<
[06:36:37] <crutchy> i think our government and reserve bank is more fiscally conservative than many others, which is probably good
[06:36:52] <keplr_prime> When you owe the bank $1,000 and can't pay, you have a problem. When you owe the bank $1,000,000,000 and can't pay, the bank has a problem.
[06:37:03] <crutchy> i do with they'd top wasting money on bullshit
[06:37:49] <crutchy> keplr_prime, yeah that is touted a lot. its a load of crap though. when you owe the chinese over a trillion dollars, they gunna get it out of you one way or another. they not gunna forget
[06:38:18] <keplr_prime> They need our dollars more than we need their goods. We are still the world's largest manufacturer and consumer market.
[06:38:33] <crutchy> but you're not
[06:38:40] <crutchy> there are over a billion chinese
[06:39:02] <keplr_prime> Most aren't part of the world's market economy.
[06:39:11] <crutchy> same with most US consumers
[06:39:19] <crutchy> many in the US are broke
[06:39:47] <keplr_prime> Which is our main problem.
[06:40:03] <crutchy> there are probably already more chinese consumers than US
[06:40:03] <keplr_prime> And it'll ruin us, because it's not seen as a problem by half the country
[06:40:26] <keplr_prime> Middle class consumers with as much disposable income in real dollars? No way.
[06:40:29] <crutchy> and there's india, africa, mid-east, south america, russia and other asian countries
[06:40:37] <crutchy> the USA is really not that big a market
[06:40:43] <keplr_prime> Well yeah if you add all of them together...
[06:41:06] <crutchy> the US is just one country that likes to think its more important than it is
[06:41:16] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - World Maker Faire Videos Now Available - http://sylnt.us - creativity-convergence
[06:41:17] <crutchy> and its struggling to maintain that sense of importance
[06:41:22] <keplr_prime> True, I wish we'd become more insular
[06:41:43] <keplr_prime> I wish we'd mind our own business, the party I always vote for supports that (Greens).
[06:41:51] <crutchy> its all about the almighty petro dollar
[06:42:07] <crutchy> international trade is good. i hope US keeps trading
[06:42:37] <crutchy> the petrodollar is dragging you down
[06:43:08] <crutchy> its given your politicians an excuse to go on a wild multi-decade binge, and now the party is almost over
[06:43:33] <crutchy> and your kids are gunna hate you for that
[06:43:49] <keplr_prime> UK navigated the end of their empire pretty well
[06:44:02] <keplr_prime> Though we lack the grace and dignity of the British.
[06:44:50] <crutchy> your government is gunna have trouble getting out of its financial hole. unfortunately ordinary hardworking americans are gunna get left holding the bag :/
[06:45:41] <crutchy> this idea that money grows on trees (keynsianism) has been the greatest excuse for politicians
[06:46:40] <keplr_prime> Some sort of basic income system should eventually be implemented
[06:46:41] <crutchy> would be nice to think it could end well, but from outside it looks a bit depressing
[06:47:06] <keplr_prime> The big revolution that needs to happen is the understanding that the market itself is a type of Commons
[06:47:15] <crutchy> you guys might end up a socialist country i think. seems like the only way out for government anyway
[06:47:23] <crutchy> nationalizing everything in sight
[06:47:44] <keplr_prime> I hope not, it's not the best solution for everthing
[06:47:56] <crutchy> nod nod. not sure what else they could do though
[06:48:08] <keplr_prime> It is for a lot of things though. We could start with healthcare
[06:48:36] <keplr_prime> Which we tried to do, but half the country would rather be sick and "free" than get "socialized" healthcare
[06:48:57] <crutchy> the ACA was a bit of a bungle. i think a lot of health insurance companies are rubbing their hands together
[06:49:23] <crutchy> socializing medicine doesn't equate to handing control over to a health insurance cartel
[06:49:30] <keplr_prime> I work in healthcare and it's been mostly a joke and an annoyance
[06:50:15] <Subsentient> $wz
[06:50:16] <aqu4> No games are in the lobby at the moment.
[06:50:26] <crutchy> its just something else to rack up debt i guess
[06:50:38] <keplr_prime> The most popular and successful medical payment system in our country is Medicare, a socialist program
[06:50:48] <crutchy> what's another few million dollars amongst trillions more
[06:51:02] <crutchy> we have medicare in australia too
[06:51:12] <keplr_prime> Well, millions of dollars really are almost rounding errors in our government.
[06:51:15] <crutchy> it might be unsustainable though
[06:51:30] <crutchy> socialized medicine still got to be paid for in tax dollars
[06:51:47] <keplr_prime> It's probably not unsustainable if you could alter certain properties
[06:51:54] <crutchy> cost of healthcare always rising
[06:51:59] <keplr_prime> But altering those properties is politically too difficult
[06:52:04] <crutchy> nod
[06:52:19] <keplr_prime> In the US we want to raise the age when Medicare kicks in
[06:52:26] <crutchy> politicians aren't very honorable, even though they demand such titles
[06:52:27] <keplr_prime> People live longer, are healthier longer
[06:52:40] <keplr_prime> We want to raise it from the current 65yrs
[06:52:50] <keplr_prime> Can't happen, seniors revolt and vote against it
[06:53:02] <crutchy> i think in australia it has already risen
[06:53:30] <crutchy> can't remember who. maybe the liberals (which oddly enough are australia's more conservative)
[06:53:37] <keplr_prime> Another big problem, we want to means test the benefits. If you're rich, you shouldn't get medicare benefits. You can pay your own way. But everyone gets it regardless.
[06:54:01] <keplr_prime> But since it's tied to years worked, we can't because people "deserve" to get that money back
[06:54:06] <crutchy> here we pay a levi, which is based on your taxable income
[06:54:18] <crutchy> s/levi/levy/
[06:54:18] <SedBot9000> <crutchy> here we pay a levy, which is based on your taxable income
[06:54:25] <keplr_prime> Similar here
[06:54:37] <keplr_prime> It's a tax on your cheque from your employer
[06:54:51] <crutchy> yeah. i guess thats sorta means testing
[06:55:08] <keplr_prime> So you pay into it all your working life, if you're really successful and don't even need it, you still get those benefits
[06:55:32] <crutchy> that's superannuation here. different from medicare
[06:55:52] <crutchy> medicare just covers costs of healthcare at the time
[06:56:12] <crutchy> if you don't use it you lose it
[06:56:41] <keplr_prime> Well for us it only starts being usable at age 65, which is when people start needing a lot of medical care.
[06:56:52] <crutchy> hmm actually i think we have a pension
[06:56:54] <keplr_prime> So everyone uses it if they live that long
[06:56:56] <crutchy> not sure how that works here
[06:57:27] <crutchy> in australia anyone is entitled to medicare regardless of age
[06:58:04] <keplr_prime> We only cover the disbaled, children, and extreme poverty.
[06:58:05] <crutchy> regardless of income. except that if you have a high income you pay a high levy in your tax
[06:58:19] <crutchy> that kinda sucks
[06:58:21] <keplr_prime> That's just single payer
[06:58:28] <keplr_prime> We call it single-payer
[06:58:45] <keplr_prime> Everyone pays into a fund based on their income, and draws from it based on their need
[06:59:17] <crutchy> here we just pay based on income regardless of need, and if you need it you get it pretty much
[06:59:22] <keplr_prime> But that's straight from Lenin's mouth! Any decent American would rather die
[06:59:44] <keplr_prime> Yeah that's what I meant
[07:00:01] <crutchy> australia's healthcare is very socialized, but that's prolly also why it may not be veery sustainable long term
[07:00:22] <keplr_prime> It's probably a falsehood that it's not sustainable
[07:00:23] <Konomi> we just have to make all the people over 70 into soylent
[07:00:25] <crutchy> especially with ageing population
[07:00:29] <crutchy> hahaha
[07:00:49] <crutchy> Konomi, i like your thinking ;p
[07:00:55] <Konomi> also it's perfectly sustainable if you have management that are willing to take the steps to fun and maintain it
[07:01:00] <Konomi> fund*
[07:01:31] <keplr_prime> It's a matter of priorities. It's not sustainable if you'd rather have a huge military, or have unsustainably low taxes for businesses
[07:01:31] <crutchy> btw Konomi has anything i've mentioned been total bs? i'm not really that up with medicare. i just know i pay over $1200/yr for it :/
[07:01:42] <Konomi> I haven't read it all
[07:01:54] <Konomi> medicare is health care for everyone
[07:02:15] <Konomi> superanuation is a bullshit system designed to "help" people retire so the government can slowly defund retirement pensions
[07:02:19] <keplr_prime> Even boat people?! D:
[07:02:25] <crutchy> Konomi++
[07:02:25] <Bender> karma - konomi: 19
[07:02:31] <crutchy> ^ re super
[07:02:34] <Konomi> the old system was the government taxes everyone
[07:02:40] <Konomi> and funds the retirements of all
[07:02:44] * crutchy doesn't have much faith in superannuation
[07:02:50] <Konomi> now it's whoever manages to earn enough who gets to retire
[07:03:15] <crutchy> i have my house. that's about all
[07:03:23] <crutchy> (when i pay it all off )
[07:03:29] <keplr_prime> Does your government scapegoat immigrants like ours does and use them as an excuse for healthcare funding being short?
[07:03:32] <Konomi> most of the country is okay with this though because only 1% of the population gets mostly screwed with super' and the rest will be fine
[07:03:45] <Konomi> though that ratio will change in the future as less people are unable to find work
[07:04:20] <crutchy> i'm worried the government will just start taxing super payments before i retire
[07:04:29] <crutchy> like capital gains
[07:04:34] <Konomi> keplr_prime: immigrants are practically the spawns of satan here
[07:04:42] <Konomi> unless they're on working visas
[07:04:44] <Konomi> then all is fine
[07:05:03] <keplr_prime> Konomi: to a lot of people here, they are too
[07:05:15] <Konomi> the country has just became a raging ball of hyprocracy since about 2000 ish
[07:05:20] <crutchy> it would be ok to just let immigrants in wholus bolus if the government didn't make it so easy to get benefits
[07:05:46] <Konomi> I often fantise about getting all land masses
[07:05:50] <keplr_prime> crutchy: that's the same argument we hear int he USA for slashing benefits for citizens
[07:05:51] <Konomi> and pushing them togehter into one big ball
[07:06:01] <Konomi> and seeing how the hell this stupid inane species reacts
[07:06:12] <keplr_prime> Pangea will happen again, eventually
[07:06:27] <Konomi> long story short
[07:06:29] <crutchy> if people want to come here to make an honest living... good on them and welcome! :D
[07:06:32] <Konomi> no one has a long term plan
[07:06:37] <Konomi> people are still dumb fucking idiots
[07:06:46] <keplr_prime> We are all just making it up as we go along
[07:06:47] <Konomi> and we're all going to be screwed in 10-20 years
[07:07:26] <keplr_prime> And yet there does seem to be an upward trend of progress in a lot of areas, for all of humanity.
[07:07:35] <keplr_prime> The longterm trends are actually really good
[07:07:48] <crutchy> if people wanna come here and just mooch off taxpayers then they can fuck off, and take all the moochers that are already here
[07:08:23] <Konomi> and I seldom engage in these dicussions anymore because it's always about the problems which have been obvious for decades and no solutions so my end conclusion is I don't bother to talk about it period
[07:08:25] <keplr_prime> crutchy: I hear that a lot in the USA, but in truth there are almost no immigrants who do that.
[07:08:31] <crutchy> i don't have issue with people looking for work that need some help, and people in truly unfortunate circumstances, but some people just rip the system off
[07:08:45] <Konomi> people shouldn't have to work
[07:08:48] <Konomi> it is a flawed concept
[07:08:51] <crutchy> a lot of welfare moochers aren't immigrants
[07:09:03] <crutchy> Konomi, true
[07:09:15] <Konomi> the next wave of technology that comes through is going to obliterate any need for human labour
[07:09:17] <keplr_prime> Konomi: agreed. Work is seen as the way a human legitimizes her existance, and that's just not sustainable
[07:09:32] <crutchy> but people shouldn't have to work to subsidize the welfare of others either
[07:09:42] <Konomi> as usual the technology is far far ahead of the maturity of our species
[07:09:46] <crutchy> if nobody worked, there would be no welfare
[07:09:55] <Konomi> it's disgusting how poor humans rate to the technology we have
[07:10:02] <keplr_prime> crutchy: eventually that won't be true
[07:10:19] <crutchy> keplr_prime, what ddo you mean?
[07:10:20] <keplr_prime> Our economy steadibly becomes less labor intensive, and more capital intensive
[07:10:37] <Konomi> I've given up a positive outlook for a collective solution
[07:10:49] <keplr_prime> Eventually, it will be fully capital intensive, and labor will not be able to produce any value for the average person
[07:10:54] <Konomi> I'm waiting for the technology to advance enough that I will have little dependance on the system in general
[07:11:06] <Konomi> so I can just devorce myself from the collective stupidity that is the human race
[07:11:12] <Konomi> well more so than I have already ;p
[07:11:34] <crutchy> keplr_prime, i don't understand. if i don't work, i don't get money. that isn't going to change i don't think
[07:11:37] <keplr_prime> Won't you always need humans for some things?
[07:12:12] <Konomi> I will always need some other humans
[07:12:15] <Konomi> just not all of them
[07:12:19] <keplr_prime> crutchy: and what happens when there are literally ZERO jobs you can do? And everyone else is in the same situation. Will you just lay down and quietly starve?
[07:12:26] <Konomi> just the interesting ones
[07:12:40] <crutchy> keplr_prime, i can't imagine that future
[07:12:45] <keplr_prime> I wish I knew more interesting people
[07:12:52] <keplr_prime> crutchy: it's not too far away
[07:13:14] <crutchy> who is going to pick fruit, cut hair, serve fastfood, etc
[07:13:22] <keplr_prime> Machines, made by machines
[07:13:29] <crutchy> who is going to maintain the machines?
[07:13:33] <crutchy> and design them?
[07:13:34] <keplr_prime> Other machines
[07:13:56] <keplr_prime> Design them = less than 0.01% of humanity
[07:14:16] <Konomi> https://www.youtube.com
[07:14:17] <monopoly> ^ 03Humans Need Not Apply - YouTube
[07:14:19] <crutchy> hmm yeah i can't see that happening soon
[07:14:35] <crutchy> machines aren't that smart yet, no matter how hard we try to make them
[07:14:37] <keplr_prime> crutchy: Humans have a hard time with exponential growth curves.
[07:14:51] <Konomi> this is a good video on the subject of technology displacing human workers
[07:15:16] <crutchy> technology does displace human workers, but new types of work are created
[07:15:29] <Konomi> he covers that falacy
[07:15:30] <crutchy> IT jobs for example didn't exist 100 years ago
[07:15:39] <Konomi> fallacy*
[07:15:41] <crutchy> now it employs millions
[07:16:51] <crutchy> even engineers have changed what they do. the demand for engineers to design and maintain steam engines has disappeared, but we design and maintain new technology instead
[07:17:06] <Konomi> video explains it all I'm not going to repeat it ;p
[07:17:19] <crutchy> i'll have a look
[07:18:06] <keplr_prime> It's a good video.
[07:18:17] <Konomi> the horse comparassion is very apt
[07:18:40] <Konomi> also the general computers link to general automation vs specific automation was well done too
[07:18:59] <crutchy> haha baxter
[07:19:05] <crutchy> dumb video so far
[07:19:26] <keplr_prime> It's very obvious when you apply it to another species, it really shows H.sapiens' hubris
[07:19:27] <Konomi> crutchy is obviously that second horse
[07:19:28] <Konomi> ;p
[07:20:55] -!- KonomiNetbook has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
[07:21:09] <crutchy> the problem is that a lot of people a reluctant to change
[07:21:18] <crutchy> reskilling is a bad word
[07:21:32] <keplr_prime> Worse than that, it's often not even possible.
[07:21:38] <Konomi> the point of this video is it doesn't matter if you reskill
[07:21:52] <Konomi> the technology will reach a point where it will eat up the majority of jobs avaiable to people
[07:21:58] <Konomi> causing a huge problem for society in general
[07:21:59] <crutchy> its only impossible if humans are incapable of learning
[07:22:27] <crutchy> its impossible to know what sort of jobs there will be in the future
[07:22:27] <keplr_prime> Will MOST humans ALWAYS be capable of learning to do jobs MORE efficiently than machines?
[07:22:36] <crutchy> chances are they won't resemble current jobs
[07:22:45] <Konomi> it'll be awhile before all humans are replaced ny machines
[07:22:59] <Konomi> it won't be awhile before ENOUGH humans are replaced by machines to cause a hugeh problme
[07:23:07] <crutchy> the luddite horse is really someone who thinks that humans are only capable of doing what robots could do cheaper
[07:23:08] <keplr_prime> We only need to reach a point where 20% can't find a job and we are in the 1920s again
[07:23:10] <Konomi> he examines this at the end of the video
[07:23:30] <Konomi> poiting out that it only takes a few more professions to be invaded by automation to make a huge problem
[07:23:44] <Konomi> since the people to profession ratio is not even across all professions
[07:24:01] <Konomi> once you can automate the top 4 with the most employes
[07:24:11] <Konomi> that's when it becomes a huge problem
[07:24:16] <crutchy> actually the real point of the video is that the cost of human labor is too high and must decrease
[07:24:16] <Konomi> I don
[07:24:21] <Konomi> 't recall the exact number
[07:24:42] <Konomi> but I think he said it we automate a few of the top professions you'll make 40% of the usa's work force redundent
[07:24:45] <crutchy> technology replaces humans in countries where the cost of human labor is high
[07:24:52] <Konomi> the great depression jobless rate was 20%
[07:24:56] <Konomi> so that's the issue
[07:25:08] <Konomi> and as he points out the robots don't have to be as good as humans
[07:25:13] <Konomi> they only have to be cheaper
[07:26:08] <crutchy> hmm yeah that video is very limited in scope. its almost propaganda
[07:26:19] <crutchy> ignores a whole heap of things
[07:27:11] <crutchy> focuses on human ingenuity to create robots, but seems to imply that we're incapable of thinking of new ways to keep ourselves busy
[07:27:21] <Konomi> I like the example of chess
[07:27:32] <Konomi> people thought computers would never be beter than them
[07:27:36] <Konomi> ended up being wrong
[07:27:47] <keplr_prime> Plenty of ways to keep busy, but who is going to pay us to lay around all day banging?
[07:27:51] <crutchy> people also thought the world was flat at some point
[07:27:58] <keplr_prime> It's not lack of things to do, it's what is profitable
[07:28:15] <crutchy> keplr_prime, that's the thing. how can anyone possibly know what human skill will be worth paying for in future?
[07:28:24] <Konomi> keplr_prime: yep the current notion of lazyness doesn't really equate to actually output
[07:28:40] <keplr_prime> crutchy: humans haven't changed much, at all, inm 200,000 years
[07:28:45] <Konomi> people refer to it as anything you do or don't do that has no percived value
[07:28:48] <crutchy> could someone in 1900 have forseen that in 2000 people would be paid for sitting on their asses all day pushing buttons?
[07:28:50] <keplr_prime> That's how long we've been a seperate species
[07:29:18] <keplr_prime> We aren't getting smarter faster than tech is replacing our need to be.
[07:29:28] <crutchy> and as much as there are robots for harvesting food, people still get paid to harvest it
[07:29:45] <Popeidol> I feel we're really in trouble when we create a computer that gets angry about their computer not working
[07:29:55] <Popeidol> until then, I can find something to earn money
[07:30:07] <keplr_prime> Eventually we're going to get overtaken, and when tech passes us on the ladder it takes out the rungs and we fall down
[07:30:11] <Konomi> why we would make computers with emotion in the first place would be more of a concern ;p
[07:30:42] <crutchy> i don't think we need to worry about robots. we'll always find some new way of using our hands or our minds that is worth a few bucks
[07:30:51] <Konomi> I love technology I think there's a place for people and puters
[07:31:01] <Konomi> but only if people change their ideas and methods
[07:31:04] <crutchy> eventually that too might be automated, but we'll come up with something else
[07:31:30] <Popeidol> having a person do things manually will become a status symbol
[07:31:32] <Konomi> and I mean on a planetary scale
[07:31:39] <crutchy> if you think computers and robots are the be all and end all, you aren't thinking outside the box
[07:31:47] <Konomi> humanity needs to grow up and set some decent goals for itself
[07:31:58] <Konomi> I won't hold my breath
[07:32:25] <keplr_prime> We can't even get everyone to be atheist
[07:32:58] <crutchy> robots can even be programmed to fuck, but i doubt prostitution is ever gunna be at risk of disappearing
[07:33:03] <chromas> Konomi: we need emotional robots so when they put us into camps and stuff then the handful of the only humans in the universe that can stop them happen to meet each other can make the robots see we're not all bad
[07:33:04] <Popeidol> maybe that's what we'll do
[07:33:15] <Popeidol> all become professional religious figures
[07:33:43] <Popeidol> that seems fairly safe from automation at the moment
[07:34:02] <keplr_prime> I lack the latent homosexuality to become a televangelist
[07:34:03] <crutchy> or politics. robots aren't stupid enough to become politicians
[07:34:36] <Popeidol> so really, we just have to pick the fields where being illogical increases your success
[07:34:57] <chromas> http://kingjamesprogramming.tumblr.com
[07:34:57] <monopoly> ^ 03King James Programming
[07:35:03] <crutchy> i'm not worried about engineering disappearing. it will certainly change though
[07:35:03] <chromas> just needs more input
[07:35:08] <Konomi> Popeidol: that could be the motto line of every human resource dept' in every company on the planet ;p
[07:35:24] <Konomi> "we just have to pick the fields where being illogical increases your success" ;p
[07:35:39] <chromas> !grab keplr_prime
[07:35:39] <Bender> Added quote 248
[07:35:40] <crutchy> !grab Popeidol
[07:35:40] <Bender> Added quote 249
[07:36:05] <crutchy> ooh good grope chromas :p
[07:37:27] <Popeidol> going by that, I guess it's time to apply for a job in the MPAA
[07:37:35] <Popeidol> it'll definitely outlast being a sysadmin
[07:38:05] <crutchy> nah sysadmins will always be needed to be yelled at when the robots fuck up
[07:38:38] <crutchy> it'll take a few generation of robots designing and building robots to gradually get rid of human fuck ups
[07:39:07] <Popeidol> 'the human race survived the singularity by turning 95% of the workforce into professioanl scapegoats'
[07:39:31] <crutchy> blessed are the cheesemakers!
[07:39:41] <chromas> are we tasty to robots?
[07:39:54] <chromas> At the moment, being tasty to humans guarantees your species
[07:39:56] <Popeidol> we are coming up with so many great scifi short story ideas here guys
[07:40:24] <crutchy> michael bay needs to remake soylent green
[07:40:41] <crutchy> with baysplosions!
[07:40:41] <exec> http://www.youtube.com
[07:41:48] <keplr_prime> chromas: it might guarantee their species, but the chicken for example isn't better off living under our farming practices than not living at all
[07:42:13] <chromas> so you see now why we need machines with feelings
[07:42:24] <Popeidol> oh god, we do
[07:42:26] <crutchy> maybe robot chickens will enslave us all
[07:42:42] <keplr_prime> The irony of fate
[07:42:55] <Popeidol> 'we only put 20 humans in this pod so you all have 10% of the required air volume, I don't know what you're complaining about'
[07:43:07] <crutchy> does fate have wrinkles?
[07:43:11] <chromas> We just have to make sure we're only tasty after 75 years so they keep us around for full lives
[07:43:22] <Popeidol> s/10%/105%/
[07:43:22] <SedBot9000> <Popeidol> 'we only put 20 humans in this pod so you all have 105% of the required air volume, I don't know what you're complaining about'
[07:45:11] <crutchy> as long as i can take the blue pill i don't really give a toss what they do to me
[07:45:33] <crutchy> cos i really like steak
[07:45:33] <Popeidol> humans evolve to be more attractive to computers in the same way that dogs have been reshaped to be more attractive to us
[07:45:43] <Popeidol> seriously somebody teach me how to write
[07:45:59] <Popeidol> there's a nebula award in this
[07:46:03] <Konomi> which language ;p ?
[07:46:22] <Popeidol> any will do, I'm not picky
[07:46:29] <crutchy> if i could get clothes that made me look like the minecraft guy i reckon i would win over a hot robot chick
[07:46:37] <Konomi> shell code then ;p ?
[07:47:12] <chromas> only if your shell was patched today
[07:47:29] <crutchy> or your patch was shelled
[07:48:54] <systemd> Speaking of taking over all the jobs...
[07:49:09] <crutchy> was it just bash? are other shells affected?
[07:49:16] <crutchy> didn't get into the issue much
[07:49:41] <crutchy> a dirk-a-dirr!
[07:50:04] <crutchy> they took mah jerb!
[07:50:47] <Popeidol> looked like it was just bash
[07:51:03] <Popeidol> it's just that bash is everywhere, including osx
[07:51:11] <crutchy> https://www.youtube.com
[07:51:11] <monopoly> ^ 03They Took Our Jobs - YouTube
[07:53:54] <chromas> someone needs to normalize
[07:54:46] <crutchy> The following packages will be REMOVED:
[07:54:46] <crutchy> bash bash-completion foomatic-db-engine foomatic-filters
[07:54:46] <crutchy> WARNING: The following essential packages will be removed.
[07:54:46] <crutchy> This should NOT be done unless you know exactly what you are doing!
[07:54:46] <crutchy> bash
[07:54:49] <crutchy> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 4 to remove and 41 not upgraded.
[07:54:51] <crutchy> After this operation, 6,024 kB disk space will be freed.
[07:54:53] <crutchy> You are about to do something potentially harmful.
[07:54:57] <crutchy> To continue type in the phrase 'Yes, do as I say!'
[07:54:59] <crutchy> ?]
[07:55:01] <crutchy> lol
[07:56:24] <Konomi> if you want to know if your bash in vulnerable btw it's:
[07:56:25] <Konomi> env x='() { :;}; echo vulnerable' bash -c "echo this is a test"
[07:56:45] <Popeidol> crutchy: did you just uninstall bash from within bash?
[07:57:23] <crutchy> mine says vulnerable
[07:57:35] <crutchy> i guess i'm toast
[07:57:47] <crutchy> mmmm toast
[07:58:17] <Konomi> wheezy got patched debian side
[07:58:20] <Konomi> testing hasn't been yet
[07:58:22] <crutchy> fucking dpkg
[07:58:39] <crutchy> wants to autoremove all of libreoffice :/
[07:58:55] <crutchy> oh i guess that's apt
[07:59:00] <crutchy> not dpkg
[07:59:35] <crutchy> what's wheezy? is that current stable? i get lost in all that stuff
[08:00:02] <Konomi> seems you cna pull bash from unstable if you're on testing to get hte fix though
[08:00:05] <Konomi> wheezy is stable
[08:00:08] <Konomi> jessie is testing
[08:00:13] <Konomi> sid is always unstable
[08:00:23] <Konomi> and experimental has no code name besides it's borked
[08:00:37] <SirFinkus> apparently the new patch doesn't fix it completely
[08:00:48] <crutchy> lol
[08:00:57] <crutchy> sid is naughty
[08:01:03] <crutchy> experimental is batshit
[08:01:53] <Popeidol> I think I'll probably just wait for the fix to come to testing, rather than start down the path of a mixed testing/unstable install
[08:02:10] <Popeidol> bash would just be the gateway package
[08:02:36] <Konomi> looks like the patch wasn't very effective
[08:02:37] <Konomi> https://bugs.debian.org
[08:02:38] <Konomi> lol
[08:02:39] <ciri> rofl
[08:05:54] <crutchy> is it an essential package? i mean couldn't i just use something like dash instead?
[08:07:30] <chromas> does dash do scripts?
[08:08:51] <crutchy> dunno. never used it
[08:09:14] <Konomi> >.<
[08:09:18] <Konomi> yes you've used it
[08:09:19] <chromas> I think that's the main reason to have bash installed
[08:09:38] <Konomi> sysvinit calls sh which is linked to /bin/dash in almost all debian distros
[08:09:58] <crutchy> lol dammit you're the shell king
[08:09:59] <chromas> see, if you were using systemd…
[08:09:59] <ciri> hahaha
[08:10:29] <crutchy> i autoremoved some font shit. now my fonts have changed :/
[08:10:45] <chromas> crutchy: time for arch
[08:10:53] <Konomi> yeah you owuldn't use it much on systemd
[08:10:58] <Konomi> but I still hace 3 instances on systemd even
[08:11:37] <crutchy> hmm does debian testing have systemd?
[08:11:45] <crutchy> tbh i never even bothered to check
[08:12:03] <Konomi> aptitude search systemd
[08:12:03] <Konomi> ;p
[08:13:23] <Popeidol> didn't ubuntu swap bash for dash as the default shell once?
[08:13:32] <Popeidol> or was that just a terrible rumour?
[08:13:53] <Konomi> no clue
[08:13:59] <crutchy> i have libsystemd-daemon0 and libsystemd-login0 installed
[08:14:27] <crutchy> does that mean there's a systemdd :p
[08:14:49] <Popeidol> google says they did in 2006
[08:14:50] <systemd> http://en.wikipedia.org
[08:14:58] <crutchy> systemd package isn't installed on my lappy vm
[08:17:05] <Konomi> you'll have parts of systemd
[08:17:13] <Konomi> to check you can just do
[08:17:48] <Konomi> ls -la "$(< /proc/1/cmdline)"
[08:18:02] <Konomi> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 20 Aug 21 08:23 /sbin/init -> /lib/systemd/systemd
[08:20:10] <crutchy> hmm first one resulted in: ls: cannot access init [2]: No such file or directory
[08:20:30] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Comcast: Competing Against Other Providers is Too Expensive - http://sylnt.us - waa-waa-boo-hoo
[08:21:04] <Konomi> echo "$(< /proc/1/comm)"
[08:21:05] <Konomi> try that
[08:21:38] <crutchy> jared@debian:~$ echo "$(< /proc/1/comm)"
[08:21:38] <crutchy> init
[08:22:04] <Konomi> what does echo "$(< /proc/1/cmdline)"
[08:22:04] <Konomi> say
[08:22:26] <crutchy> jared@debian:~$ echo "$(< /proc/1/cmdline)"
[08:22:26] <crutchy> init [2]
[08:22:37] <Konomi> guess that's something sysvinit does
[08:22:47] <crutchy> dunno
[08:22:48] <Konomi> ls -la /sbin/init
[08:22:55] <Konomi> less fancy way
[08:23:12] <crutchy> jared@debian:~$ ls -la /sbin/init
[08:23:12] <crutchy> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 36992 Jul 15 2013 /sbin/init
[08:23:15] <Popeidol> I feel it would save time if we all just gave konomi ssh access to our machines
[08:23:22] <crutchy> yes
[08:23:30] <Konomi> mbr nyancat for all
[08:24:21] <Konomi> bizare no symlinked init...
[08:24:29] <Konomi> file /sbin/init
[08:24:33] <crutchy> as soon as my apt-get upgrade finishes i gunna see if i can remove the systemd packages. see what happens'
[08:24:44] <Konomi> what DE do you use?
[08:24:52] <crutchy> jared@debian:~$ file /sbin/init
[08:24:53] <crutchy> /sbin/init: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.6.18, BuildID[sha1]=0x8c68a736c6a4e6fadf22d5ac9debf11e79c6bdcd, stripped
[08:25:06] <Konomi> how old is this install...
[08:25:07] <ciri> don't ask me!
[08:25:11] <crutchy> gnome3 i think
[08:25:18] <Konomi> it'd break gnome3
[08:25:23] <Popeidol> ...2.6.18
[08:26:04] <Konomi> I still have an older vm using sysvinit debian wheezy we'll see what it says
[08:26:11] <crutchy> pfft i don't even know how to check my gnome version :/
[08:26:52] <Konomi> wonder when they patched lightdm to support lower reses
[08:27:38] <Konomi> hmm I guess wheezy and pre wheezy never symlinked init
[08:28:00] <Konomi> Popeidol: that version doesn't mean anything btw
[08:28:07] <Popeidol> I figured it mustn't
[08:28:14] <crutchy> looks like kernel version
[08:28:14] <Popeidol> otherwise he's running sarge or something
[08:28:16] <Konomi> $ file /lib/systemd/systemd
[08:28:17] <Konomi> /lib/systemd/systemd: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.6.32, BuildID[sha1]=b3ac6616b8b80643ed856efc43f3d2021440f20f, stripped
[08:28:40] <Konomi> i think it just implies the oldest kernel it can run on
[08:29:03] <crutchy> ah yeah i guess its wheezy
[08:29:04] <crutchy> deb http://ftp.au.debian.org wheezy main contrib non-free
[08:29:04] <monopoly> ^ 03Index of /debian
[08:29:26] <crutchy> might be server thats on testing
[08:30:38] <Konomi> apt-cache policy
[08:30:41] <Konomi> is the way to tell
[08:31:15] <crutchy> looks like stable
[08:33:05] <Konomi> lets see how much crap my old wheezy ui needs to update
[08:33:25] <Konomi> 74mb
[08:33:31] <Konomi> not bad for something I haven't touched in a year
[08:36:44] <Popeidol> !grab Konomi
[08:36:49] <Popeidol> damn
[08:37:02] <Konomi> mew?
[08:37:07] <Konomi> which part of that was even funny ;p
[08:37:37] <crutchy> contained a keyword in the male sexual database
[08:38:35] <Popeidol> fits perfectly in the comedy genre of 'imagine I am saying this about my penis'
[08:39:46] <Konomi> wouldn't it be like touched in the last hour for that case ;p ?
[08:39:50] <Konomi> nograbu
[08:40:15] <crutchy> hour?! who can last that long?
[08:40:23] <Konomi> heh I just found a neat pun on the eat sleep rave repeat
[08:40:24] <Popeidol> Konomi: my office has policies preventing that sort of thing
[08:40:38] <Konomi> /* write, compile, run, repeat */
[08:41:15] <crutchy> for php its write, run, bork, repeat
[08:41:42] <Konomi> write run fork repeat
[08:42:55] <crutchy> one day robots will be able to automate forking of systemd
[08:44:34] <Konomi> they already have *dramatic music*
[08:45:40] <crutchy> we should lobby debian to get Subsentient's init thingy into the repos
[08:47:09] <crutchy> or maybe exec could be an init thingy.. lol imagine a php init ;P
[08:47:22] <chromas> crutchy: maybe it already is; better do a search
[08:47:25] <chromas> epohc
[08:47:29] <chromas> epoch
[08:48:15] <chromas> but not the time/date util
[08:48:39] <crutchy> nope :/
[08:48:49] <chromas> better switch to gentoo
[08:49:00] <Popeidol> epoch will never take off until it absorbs cowsay and minetest
[08:49:12] <crutchy> minetest?
[08:49:43] <Popeidol> opensource minecraft equivalent
[08:49:50] <crutchy> ooh?
[08:50:09] <crutchy> minecruft
[08:50:18] <Popeidol> except not written in java so it runs just fine on my desktop from 2006
[08:51:01] <systemd> java--
[08:51:01] <Bender> karma - java: -9
[08:51:47] <crutchy> pascal++
[08:51:47] <Bender> karma - pascal: 27
[08:51:58] <chromas> pascal++
[08:51:58] <Bender> karma - pascal: 28
[08:58:40] <Subsentient> c++
[08:58:40] <Bender> karma - c: 27
[09:01:43] <crutchy> c++
[09:01:43] <Bender> karma - c: 28
[09:01:58] <Konomi> https://www.youtube.com
[09:01:58] <monopoly> ^ 03Bonecage - I Phreak Alone music video - YouTube
[09:02:24] <crutchy> http://www.totaljerkface.com
[09:02:24] <monopoly> ^ 03Totaljerkface.com - Home Of Happy Wheels
[09:03:26] * crutchy likes the 'run human run 2' level with the hay cart
[09:21:00] <Popeidol> I have no idea what this is
[09:21:06] <Popeidol> but I think I am going to have to play it a lot
[09:23:55] <crutchy> it involves human characters being disemboweled
[09:24:03] <crutchy> what could be better?
[09:24:29] <Popeidol> I decided to play it more when I was half a human hanging onto a segway as I ran from a dinosaur
[09:24:43] <exec> crutchy is a robot!
[09:25:10] <systemd> crutchy is a robot!
[09:25:33] <Konomi> sloppy ai for a robot
[09:25:36] * Konomi hides
[09:25:51] * crutchy gives Konomi a big robot smooch
[09:25:58] <Konomi> cold >.>
[09:32:24] <crutchy> ~sn-submit http://www.bbc.com
[09:32:45] <crutchy> hmm someone should make a script that does that
[09:33:18] <chromas> Except it also needs to write a summary of the article
[09:33:41] <crutchy> could extract from the linked page
[09:33:50] <chromas> Also make it look for other sources and integrate them into the summary 😊
[09:33:56] <crutchy> ooh yeah
[09:34:32] <chromas> exec will never be complete!!
[09:36:05] <crutchy> if it ever gets complete i'll have nothing to do
[09:36:16] <crutchy> don't want that
[09:36:42] <chromas> Eventually it will take over its own improvements
[09:39:00] -!- prospectacle [prospectacle!~3a6b4618@r12-866-96-71.mit440.act.optusnet.com.au] has joined #Soylent
[09:39:22] <crutchy> ~g'day prospectacle
[09:39:22] <exec> * crutchy pulchritudinously passes a cheap plastic cup of Soylent Green to prospectacle
[09:39:24] <prospectacle> evenings
[09:39:50] <prospectacle> mm my favourite drink in my favourite vessel
[09:51:39] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Ask Soylent: Inexpensive Winter Project for a Geek? - http://sylnt.us - betteridge-says-no?
[10:04:29] <crutchy> programming is the best project
[10:04:52] <prospectacle> cheapest, certainly
[10:04:57] <crutchy> start with hello world and keep going till you have your own operating system and home grown utils
[10:05:01] <prospectacle> you can make all kinds of things without any new hardware
[10:05:06] <prospectacle> lol
[10:05:06] <ciri> hahaha
[10:05:10] <prospectacle> ciri--
[10:05:10] <Bender> karma - ciri: 6
[10:05:46] <prospectacle> why stop there, keep going till you have true artificial intelligence that can figure out how to take control of other servers without your help, but is always loyal and does your bidding
[10:06:03] <prospectacle> and also can drive your car
[10:06:24] <crutchy> and blackmail your boss
[10:06:29] <prospectacle> well obviously
[10:07:00] <crutchy> and sell out to google
[10:07:09] <crutchy> hmm wait not that one
[10:07:13] <crutchy> bad ai
[10:10:40] <chromas> The ai makes something google thinks it wants, you make money selling it then it takes google down
[10:11:50] <prospectacle> chromas, that's brilliant, have your ai and eat it too
[10:12:18] <prospectacle> apparently the original phrase was "eat your cake and have it" which makes far more sense
[10:13:40] <chromas> I recently saw a movie where Johnny Depp doesn't wear a ton of makeup or look like a freak. I was surprised
[10:13:56] <Popeidol> so he actually has a face under there?
[10:14:02] <prospectacle> what movie?
[10:14:20] <crutchy> is it that corny western?
[10:14:30] <crutchy> lone ranger
[10:14:44] <chromas> He died and his coworkers scanned his brain and put it into an ai cluster
[10:14:45] <crutchy> saw that the other day. funny
[10:14:49] <crutchy> ooh
[10:15:55] <chromas> Don't recall the name
[10:16:20] <JamesNZ> Transcendence?
[10:17:28] <chromas> That looks right
[10:22:04] <prospectacle> billy and the clonosaurus?
[10:22:32] <chromas> And gray goo near the end
[10:23:15] * JamesNZ liked The Lone Ranger
[10:23:21] <crutchy> sounds like a crichton ripoff
[10:23:26] <chromas> Yeah that's it. Netcraft confirms it
[10:23:39] <JamesNZ> hugo++
[10:23:39] <Bender> karma - hugo: 1
[10:23:51] <chromas> Most movies are ripoffs
[10:23:52] <crutchy> hugo_weaving++
[10:23:52] <Bender> karma - hugo_weaving: 1
[10:24:21] <chromas> Is that the one with the kid living in the walls to manage the clocks?
[10:24:37] <crutchy> 'a villain so cool, they just copied him a bunch of times instead of coming up with another cool bad guy'
[10:24:38] <JamesNZ> Yep, that's the one. Great film.
[10:24:50] <chromas> The end sucked
[10:25:02] <JamesNZ> I loved the end :)
[10:25:35] <chromas> Always gotta ruin stories with "and they found a loving family and became regular kids"
[10:25:40] <prospectacle> i was surprised to learn that both hamlet, and romeo and juliet, are well known rip-offs, plot wise.
[10:25:59] <chromas> Shakespeare--
[10:25:59] <Bender> karma - shakespeare: -1
[10:26:00] <prospectacle> of amleth, and pyramus and thisbe, respectively
[10:26:00] <JamesNZ> chromas: Heh.
[10:26:44] <JamesNZ> chromas: Did you listen to the soundtrack? It's flippin' brilliant.
[10:26:49] <JamesNZ> howard_shore++
[10:26:50] <Bender> karma - howard_shore: 1
[10:27:19] <chromas> Ooh I should go listen
[10:27:22] <crutchy> howard shore did saving private ryan as well?
[10:27:28] <JamesNZ> It's on youtube :)
[10:27:30] * crutchy has heard of howard shore
[10:27:46] <JamesNZ> Hmm, not sure.
[10:28:20] <crutchy> alan_silvestri++
[10:28:20] <Bender> karma - alan_silvestri: 1
[10:29:10] * JamesNZ sees he scored The Avengers
[10:29:25] <prospectacle> oh no I've got moderator points. the horrible dark tempting power of it all
[10:30:07] <crutchy> prospectacle, s/ting/lar/
[10:30:07] <SedBot9000> <crutchy> <prospectacle> oh no I've got moderator points. the horrible dark templar power of it all
[10:31:14] <chromas> Power overwhelming
[10:35:33] <prospectacle> what is this, I can't mod my own posts up into the heavens, what foul corruption is at play
[10:38:18] <prospectacle> I could be a mercenary I guess. Anyone got any mod-scores they want me to settle. Rates very reasonable
[10:39:00] <Konomi> ha
[10:39:02] <chromas> modexchange
[10:39:05] <Konomi> zsh has a version of the bash bug
[10:39:24] <chromas> I bet fish doesn't
[10:39:31] <chromas> no script support, no bug
[10:39:34] <chromas> maybe
[10:40:28] <Konomi> https://bugzilla.redhat.com
[10:40:30] <monopoly> ^ 03Bug 1141597 – CVE-2014-6271 bash: specially-crafted environment variables can be used to inject shell commands
[10:40:39] <Konomi> Just as a heads up: The second vulnerability seems also to work with zsh (zsh 4.3.10 (x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu) on CentOS 6.5 and zsh (zsh 4.3.9 (i386-apple-darwin10.0) on Mac.
[10:41:36] <chromas> dammit, how're we supposed to lord Linux's surperior design if it's vulnerable too?
[10:44:03] <Popeidol> easy
[10:44:18] <Popeidol> 'oh, zfs was always solaris really. that's why we built btrfs'
[10:44:41] <chromas> zsh the shell
[10:44:56] <chromas> ooh let's all switch over to btrfs
[10:46:24] <Popeidol> oh
[10:46:48] <Popeidol> well that makes a lot more sense than a filesystem suffering from a shell exploit
[10:47:06] <chromas> too many initialisms
[10:47:32] <prospectacle> what does one have to do to be vulnerable? run a naughy shell script?
[10:47:58] <chromas> something has to fill an environment veriable
[10:48:03] <chromas> like through cgi or something
[10:49:35] <crutchy> verrbles++
[10:49:35] <Bender> karma - verrbles: 1
[10:49:41] <prospectacle> guess i'll have 2 check my servers then
[10:50:11] <crutchy> exec isn't vulnerable... it only executes stuff that exposes my passwords
[10:50:34] <prospectacle> ~password crutchy
[10:50:49] <prospectacle> ~cowsay crutchy's password
[10:50:50] <exec> ____________________
[10:50:50] <exec> < crutchy's password >
[10:50:50] <exec> --------------------
[10:50:50] <exec> \ ^__^
[10:50:50] <exec> \ (oo)\_______
[10:50:50] <exec> (__)\ )\/\
[10:50:51] <exec> ||----w |
[10:50:51] <exec> || ||
[10:51:16] <crutchy> need a new cowsay
[10:52:04] <prospectacle> ~capybara say I'm hungry
[10:52:16] <Popeidol> bullsay will require few modifications
[10:52:49] <crutchy> need a script that uses patorjk.com/software/taag
[10:55:52] <crutchy> rofl
[10:55:52] <ciri> now that is funny
[10:55:54] <exec> Confucius say… he who has a sharp tongue cuts own throat.
[11:07:54] -!- rand [rand!~rand@cea-547.64-463-42.nts-online.net] has joined #Soylent
[11:13:35] <crutchy> rofl
[11:13:35] <ciri> HEHEHEHE
[11:13:38] <exec> It is easier to square the circle than to get round a mathematician.
[11:14:01] <crutchy> rofl
[11:14:01] <ciri> HAHAHAHA
[11:14:03] <exec> If at first you don’t succeed, then skydiving definitely isn’t for you.
[11:16:21] <prospectacle> the quotes file is the modern day commonplace book
[11:17:38] <crutchy> www.just-one-liners.com
[11:17:56] <crutchy> its a little scraper script
[11:18:47] <crutchy> mostly confucius though (75% chance)
[11:18:51] <crutchy> rofl
[11:18:54] <exec> Confucius say… woman who spring on innerspring this spring have offspring next spring.
[11:19:42] <crutchy> www.just-one-liners.com/category/confucius-say-wordplay
[11:24:45] <JamesNZ> fedora++
[11:24:45] <Bender> karma - fedora: 20
[11:27:30] <chromas> ubuntu-- # for NCommander
[11:27:30] <Bender> karma - ubuntu: -1
[11:29:00] <Subsentient> Fedora is good. Real good. CentOS is just old Fedora.
[11:29:29] <JamesNZ> Subsentient++ # Truth :)
[11:29:29] <Bender> karma - subsentient: 13
[11:29:43] <JamesNZ> Subsentient: How's it going?
[11:29:55] <Subsentient> JamesNZ: Lots of warzone
[11:30:00] <Subsentient> spent some hours training a noob
[11:30:22] <JamesNZ> Nice.
[11:30:51] <JamesNZ> I binged a bit on WZ as well this week.
[11:34:10] <crutchy> i binged on caramel crown biscuits
[11:35:01] <Subsentient> JamesNZ: I often binge on chocolate. And I'm a dude. I love my chocolate.
[11:35:14] <Subsentient> The sugar makes the anxiety worse but oh well
[11:36:45] <JamesNZ> Subsentient: Heh :P
[11:37:21] * JamesNZ is off to bed now, night all \o
[11:37:27] -!- JamesNZ has quit [Quit: Busying myself...]
[11:37:59] <crutchy> ~time nz
[11:38:00] <exec> Thursday, 25 September 2014 @ 11:38 pm GMT+12 - Wellington, New Zealand 12:23 AM+1 day Chatham Island (GMT+12:45)
[11:38:12] <Subsentient> $time America/Phoenix
[11:38:12] <aqu4> Thu 2014-09-25 04:37:36 AM America/Phoenix
[11:38:20] <crutchy> ~weather
[11:38:21] <exec> Weather for Traralgon VIC, Australia - currrently 49°F, partly cloudy, wind W at 3 mph, humidity 98% - Thursday chance of rain (63°F, 43°F), Friday chance of rain (63°F, 43°F), Saturday clear (70°F, 50°F), Sunday clear (79°F, 46°F) - source: Google
[11:38:40] <Subsentient> $coin will it rain?
[11:38:40] * aqu4 flips a bubblegum covered penny on "will it rain?"
[11:38:40] <aqu4> I got heads.
[11:38:46] <crutchy> $convert deg F to C
[11:51:07] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Micropower and the State of Low Carbon Power Generation - http://sylnt.us - power-to-the-people
[12:09:53] <crutchy> coffee++
[12:09:53] <Bender> karma - coffee: 852
[12:10:23] <ar> coffee--
[12:10:23] <Bender> karma - coffee: 851
[12:10:37] <ar> coffee--
[12:10:37] <Bender> karma - coffee: 850
[12:26:08] -!- Subsentient has quit [Quit: A good gerbil is one with the peanut butter.]
[12:45:17] <crutchy> ooh mod points mwahahaha!!! >;-)
[12:46:39] <Popeidol> today I actually managed to use 7 of them before they expired
[12:46:45] <Popeidol> O tjoml tjat
[12:46:49] <Popeidol> I think that's a personal best
[12:47:19] <crutchy> aw feck. just moderated and then got logged out when i clicked home :/
[12:47:47] <crutchy> meh. can't be arsed moderating anyway. means i have to read stuff
[12:56:26] -!- exec has quit [Quit: dafuq]
[12:56:44] <paulej72> coffee++
[12:56:44] <Bender> karma - coffee: 851
[12:57:44] <paulej72> strange TheMightyBuzzard has not made an enterance yet this morning
[12:58:00] <crutchy> ~time TheMightyBuzzard
[12:58:07] <crutchy> oops
[12:58:13] <crutchy> 404 bot not found
[12:58:15] <TheMightyBuzzard> paulej72, around, just dragging ass and catching up on news
[12:58:33] <paulej72> did you coffee++ yet :)
[12:58:36] <crutchy> mornin'
[12:58:39] <TheMightyBuzzard> coffee++
[12:58:39] <Bender> karma - coffee: 852
[12:58:46] <TheMightyBuzzard> workin on it
[12:58:54] <crutchy> getting close to bed time for me
[12:59:23] <crutchy> tgif in an hour
[12:59:27] <paulej72> I think we do are best work wen we do not sleep
[13:00:05] <TheMightyBuzzard> not me. i do my best shat after a good night's sleep during the first 4-6 hours of being awake.
[13:00:09] <paulej72> I should switch to Austrailian time here
[13:00:56] <paulej72> Then I could go home
[13:02:01] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - New Military Base Could Seal Fate of Okinawa Dugong - http://sylnt.us - or-the-dugongs-seal-the-fate-of-the-military-base
[13:02:33] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'd say i'm feelin your pain but i work from home mostly so it wouldn't help
[13:07:32] <TheMightyBuzzard> took one look at slash this morning and my brain rebelled, so i'm changing things up and coding up a simple translation irc bot for another server/channel to clear the head.
[13:15:36] -!- TK [TK!~9ff52002@159.245.ju.y] has joined #Soylent
[13:31:48] -!- exec [exec!~exec@709-27-2-01.cust.aussiebb.net] has joined #Soylent
[13:32:18] <crutchy> oooh "a simple translation irc bot for another server/channel"?
[13:34:12] <crutchy> will it be the master SN slash api bot?
[13:37:45] blckmoore|afk is now known as Blackmoore
[13:38:03] <Blackmoore> coffee++
[13:38:03] <Bender> karma - coffee: 853
[13:38:47] <TheMightyBuzzard> crutchy, nah. s'for a game.
[13:39:10] <crutchy> cool
[13:39:20] <TheMightyBuzzard> needed something light and pointless to clear the head, this appears to be working so far.
[13:39:37] <crutchy> at least you might finish it. i'm wondering if irciv will ever be finished :/
[13:41:22] <TheMightyBuzzard> just using a simple little sqlite db to hold translations. shouldn't be too difficult to look up by either value.
[13:51:00] -!- LaminatorX [LaminatorX!~18d900fb@Soylent/Staff/Editor/LaminatorX] has joined #Soylent
[13:51:00] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v LaminatorX] by juggler
[14:11:01] <Landon> http://blog.erratasec.com
[14:11:03] <Landon> ballsy
[14:11:10] <Landon> checked my logs and his probe is in there
[14:11:19] <Landon> literally executing code on other people's machines
[14:16:21] <prospectacle> Does anyone have any pointers for how I can test my web-servers for this vulnerability. One is a vps, one's a shared host.
[14:16:37] <prospectacle> sounds like a scary problem if I don't catch it before some bastard
[14:21:00] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Bodhi Linux Bounces Back! - http://sylnt.us - good-luck-to-the-new-guys,-and-thanks-to-the-old
[14:23:36] <Landon> prospectacle: open up bash
[14:23:46] <Landon> foo='() { echo "hi mom"; }' bash -c 'foo'
[14:23:52] <Landon> if that prints out "hi mom" you're vulnerable
[14:24:18] <Landon> sounds like it's still not 100% patched either
[14:25:07] <prospectacle> ok thanks i'll try it.
[14:26:41] <LaminatorX> My machines at home ar vulnerable, but the only exposed service is dhcpd on our wifi. If soneone's attacking my network from my driveway, I've got bigger problems.
[14:27:09] <prospectacle> how could someone exploit it. I mean I assume they don't have to be able to open a bash shell on your machine, but what do they have to do?
[14:27:46] <LaminatorX> I think that the bug passes data to the parent shell process.
[14:28:13] <Landon> prospectacle: for example, apache will set some stuff from HTTP headers as env variables
[14:28:41] <Landon> so you can create functions there and I'm fuzzy on the next step, but get them called at some other point
[14:28:41] <prospectacle> I see. and then it gets executed immediately?
[14:29:01] <prospectacle> thanks. I'll keep reading about it
[14:29:04] <Landon> http://lcamtuf.blogspot.com
[14:30:26] <Konomi> the more I read into this bash flaw the more scary it becomes
[14:32:40] <Konomi> "However, it is true that if CGI programs spawn subprocesses, they may be
[14:32:41] <Konomi> affected even if the CGI program itself is not written in bash."
[14:32:43] <Konomi> oh fun
[14:33:11] <Blackmoore> geh.. i'v got two systems to patch when i get home. if i get home tonight
[14:34:59] <Konomi> Landon: you're misunderstanding the bug a bit
[14:35:04] <Konomi> For example, an environment variable setting of
[14:35:10] <Konomi> VAR=() { ignored; }; /bin/id
[14:35:17] <Konomi> will execute /bin/id when the environment is imported into the bash
[14:35:35] <Konomi> it's the later part that is the problem
[14:37:21] <TheMightyBuzzard> sigh, i gotta patch god knows how many. gonna be a busy day.
[14:38:38] <Konomi> you're basically calling a function you defined in that example which is normal operation
[14:38:41] <Konomi> env x='() { :;}; echo vulnerable' bash -c "echo this is a test"
[14:38:44] <Konomi> this is red hats example
[14:39:01] <Konomi> you define the variable just call bash and it'll execute the code in the defined variable
[14:39:04] <Konomi> that's the bug
[14:39:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> which is a pita if you have apache writing to env vars
[14:40:04] * Konomi nod nods
[14:43:34] <prospectacle> so you need to a: set an env var, b: cause bash to be called
[14:43:35] <prospectacle> is that right?
[14:43:49] <prospectacle> and bash might be called by various things, like php calling system()
[14:44:01] <Konomi> yes
[14:44:41] <prospectacle> hmm
[14:46:28] <Landon> Konomi: OH, that makes more sense
[14:46:39] <Landon> but that was the part that was patched, correct? the appended function
[14:46:54] <Konomi> yeah but now there's a new flavour that needs ot be patched ;_;
[14:47:21] <Konomi> env X='() { (a)=>\' bash -c "echo date"; cat echo
[14:50:38] <n1> we're all doomed.
[14:51:54] <prospectacle> if i turn of cgi access does this help, or is apache vulnerable anyway/
[14:52:14] <prospectacle> I've got one host that's a shared one, so I can't control what's installed on it, but there's a "enable cgi access" option I can turn off.
[14:52:26] <Konomi> redhat list some mitgations don't know how useful they are
[14:52:27] <Konomi> https://access.redhat.com
[14:52:36] <monopoly> ^ 03Red Hat Customer Portal
[14:53:04] <prospectacle> thanks konomi
[14:53:50] <prospectacle> every few days something happens in the news (this is one example) that makes me think this is still the wild-west of the internet, and we'll look back on it with shock and surprise that anyone ventured into it when it was so dangerous and untamed
[14:54:23] <Konomi> it'll be like heartbleed lots of panic bu tnothing will happen ;p
[14:54:24] <prospectacle> our children will be bored to tears with our stories about the bad old days, but our grandchildren will find it mildy entertaining
[14:54:29] <prospectacle> I hope you're right
[14:55:27] <prospectacle> if mod_php is unaffected I should be ok
[14:55:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> ya think?
[14:56:06] <Konomi> I'll read through it more later when I get time
[14:56:57] <TheMightyBuzzard> i'm more worried about apache itself than any mods installed
[14:58:50] <prospectacle> could be. According to the redhat page konomi linked, the apache related risk is cgi passing environment variables to scripts
[14:59:03] <Konomi> that would be correct
[14:59:14] <prospectacle> if that's true then maybe no cgi = no problem, but of course I could be wrong. Worth looking into further, no doubt.
[14:59:20] <Konomi> it's a lot of ifs and maybes
[14:59:25] <prospectacle> yah
[15:00:04] <prospectacle> luckily I downloaded some backups from the server today. Our new office internet is pretty sweet. 1.2 gigs in 4 minutes
[15:00:23] <Konomi> that's the kind of sucky part really
[15:00:25] <Konomi> you cna't be sure
[15:00:58] <prospectacle> yeah I'm surprised the web hosts I used haven't put up any updates or advisories yet. That's kind of their job. I mean it's partly mine, but, you know
[15:04:16] <Blackmoore> I hope mint has an update i can just run. I'll have worked 10 or so hours by the time i get home. anything that requires thought is gonna get screwed up.
[15:05:02] <prospectacle> yeah fried brains are no good for doing important things.
[15:05:18] <prospectacle> I wonder how long till someone kick starts a headband that measures how fried your brain is
[15:05:42] <prospectacle> i should add: which actually materialises and works
[15:07:57] <NCommander> I see a hightlight here but no words
[15:08:47] <prospectacle> Hi NCommander
[15:20:50] <TheMightyBuzzard> mornin, NC
[15:25:29] <Blackmoore> monin NC
[15:26:11] <LaminatorX> That actually sounds kind of profound.
[15:26:31] <prospectacle> anyone seen "Gotham" I'm suspicious it will be shit, but I'm gonna give it a go just in case
[15:27:24] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm? never heard of it.
[15:28:00] <prospectacle> it's like the batman universe but I think set around the time his parents were killed
[15:29:03] <prospectacle> it's on the hulu
[15:29:22] <LaminatorX> I've been meaning to check it out. Reviews have been posative.
[15:29:32] <n1> prospectacle
[15:29:40] <n1> i saw Gotham the other day
[15:29:42] <n1> it's not bad
[15:30:15] <n1> I went into it with no preconceptions though, i have absolutely 0 interest in batham/gotham and it worked for me so far.
[15:30:21] <prospectacle> correction (just turned it on) it's set exactly at the time his parents were killed
[15:30:35] <TheMightyBuzzard> where's the fun of that?
[15:31:01] <n1> it's not really about batman, i thought the first episode set the show up pretty well
[15:31:11] <n1> as someone who has 0 interest in batman normally
[15:31:13] <prospectacle> n1, i hope it's good there's a lot of interesting potential in a city like gotham, if handled well
[15:31:34] <LaminatorX> Seems to be centered on Gordon and Bullock as partner detectives. Gordon as the idealist having to compromise pragmatically within the corrupt system, and Bullock as the corrupt veteran reminded by Gordon why he once gave a damn.
[15:32:17] <TheMightyBuzzard> Plenty of potential but why bother with it being set in Gotham? Any city would do if you're not gonna have Bats in it.
[15:32:34] <LaminatorX> Sounds like a 70's cop drama, like Serpico or the French Connection, set in Gotham.
[15:32:40] <n1> prospectacle, it has potential - i'm going to try and stick with it for at least the first season
[15:32:48] <prospectacle> well there's branding I suppose. also I guess they can have prequel stories to a lot of the villains and heroes of the series
[15:32:56] <TheMightyBuzzard> hrm
[15:32:58] <LaminatorX> Because Smallville ran for nearly a decade, TheMightyBuzzard.
[15:33:22] <prospectacle> LaminatorX that's probably the more accurate answer
[15:33:52] <TheMightyBuzzard> Yes and some of the episodes without Kristin Kreuk were even good
[15:35:46] <LaminatorX> If this show has similar legs, they could actually have that kid becoming batman by the end of it, if he turns out to be a decent actor.
[15:36:34] <prospectacle> so many sites have terrible and buggy video players, i think youtube could have a nice incomeo stream just providing a white-label player to other video sites
[15:36:57] <LaminatorX> Depending on contracts as well, of course. Smallville had a bunch of weird restrictions.
[15:37:28] <prospectacle> youtube's player is pretty amazingly good but you don't realise than until you try almost anything else thoroughly
[15:39:47] <prospectacle> hulu for example, try using the "back ten seconds" button more than three times. It will break completely until you reload the page.
[15:40:41] <prospectacle> in a row, that is
[15:52:09] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Lies, Damned lies, and Baby Names in Israel - http://sylnt.us - honesty-is-still-the-best-policy
[16:00:46] LaminatorX is now known as LaminatorX|out2lunch
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[16:20:44] <paulej72> On Gotham: they introduced Flacone, The Penguin, Cat Woman(girl at this stage) and possibly the Joker. I thoutht is was not bad. The cityscape looked to be mostly CGI
[16:58:33] <exec> score 5 comment: 03tempest [3050] 02... - 06Russia Says It’s Putting A Man on the Moon… By 2030. - 04 http://soylentnews.org
[17:11:08] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Obama Presses China on Global Warming - http://sylnt.us - obama-sharing-world-leadership-with-china
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[17:27:45] <exec> score 5 comment: 03prospectacle [3422] 02You could try to make a game - 06Ask Soylent: Inexpensive Winter Project for a Geek? - 04 http://soylentnews.org
[17:32:34] <Landon> build an eglooo
[18:32:09] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Race for ‘5G’ Technologies is 'Ridiculous' - http://sylnt.us - amateurs,-we're-working-on-6G
[18:57:45] <exec> score 5 comment: 03subs [4485] 02Re:"half of the world’s electricity produced witho - 06Micropower and the State of Low Carbon Power Generation - 04 http://soylentnews.org
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[19:54:48] -!- mode/#Soylent [+v Subsentient] by juggler
[20:11:24] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Gravity Waves, a Noir - http://sylnt.us - infinite-particles-in-the-big-city
[20:11:37] <Blackmoore> and here we go..
[20:24:40] <LaminatorX> So far, so good.
[20:41:26] <Blackmoore> Oh god. the links in the sidebar. I didnt think about that when i set up the link.
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[20:46:46] <LaminatorX> Next time, make the sidebar form an acrostic.
[20:51:04] <Blackmoore> hehehe i love it..
[20:53:09] <Blackmoore> who knows. maybe I'll start a series of these. Dark matter comes to mind
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[21:40:30] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Contrary to Reporting, Climate Scientists Seen as Trustworthy by Americans - http://sylnt.us - journalists-not-to-be-trusted
[21:40:32] <Blackmoore> Higgs boson. any creature thought extinct and then located.. this could be stupid/fun
[21:41:02] <Blackmoore> I havnet seen a complaint yet.. lets see what 24 hours brings.
[21:44:29] <chromas> Well, if nobody else is gonna complain... :D
[21:44:32] <chromas> "We knew there were there"
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[21:54:07] <chromas> ooh, the bash bug has a name
[22:02:26] <AndyTheAbsurd> yup, "shellshock"
[22:15:56] <chromas> can't believe they'd bash the shell like that
[22:17:57] <chromas> http://www.troyhunt.com
[22:18:10] <chromas> it even mentions netcraft
[22:18:19] <chromas> (confirms it)
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[22:42:27] <mrcoolbp> Blackmoore: well the reviews were mixed I guess
[23:01:31] <Bender> [SoylentNews] - Chemists Recruit Anthrax to Deliver Cancer Drugs. - http://sylnt.us - domestication
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